niconj Posted May 27, 2017 Report Share Posted May 27, 2017 (edited) I know that it's down to personal preference but some pointers you might still have. I've got some money to spare and want to buy a new frameset. How does the Arcade compare to my 2012 4play? Geometry (4play) Wheelbase: 1020mm Chainstay: 375mm BB Height: +25mm Head Angle: 73˚ Geometry (Arcade) Wheelbase: 1000mm Chainstay: 364mm BB Height: +25mm Head Angle: 74,5˚ My 4play bunny hops rather well I think but I don't have any comparison as I haven't ridden any modern street trial geometry yet. What I currently focus on is spinning and front wheel moves and bunny hops (of course). I know that riding wise, I haven't reached the limits of my current bike yet, nor will I ever do but I would like a change. Still, I may profit some of a new frameset. And to make things even more difficult, I really like the new TMS Silex: Geometry (Arcade) Wheelbase: 998mm Chainstay: 350mm BB Height: +22mm Head Angle: 74,5˚ Edited May 27, 2017 by niconj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff costello Posted May 27, 2017 Report Share Posted May 27, 2017 350 chainstays? isn't that 20" territory? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2017 (edited) 12 minutes ago, jeff costello said: 350 chainstays? isn't that 20" territory? That's what it says on their homepage for the complete bike. The framset is stated with 352mm chainstays. It does seem a little short, probably a typo. Should be 362mm. Edited May 27, 2017 by niconj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topsy Posted May 27, 2017 Report Share Posted May 27, 2017 (edited) Not entirely sure anymore how the 2012 fourplay felt as I never owned one, but my 2010* fourplay felt very cramped after a while and I used to get lower back pains riding it. The arcade feels lighter in a way and it's not that noticeable that it's under you if that makes sense. I felt like I'm standing in in, being more upright with less weight on your arms. That said, I could pedal up higher with less difficulties with my fourplay, but that might be down to practice or lack of it.. All in all, for me switching to the arcade was brilliant. It's a right hoot to ride 'normally' too. No idea how the TMS Silex would compare though. *2011? No idea anymore.. I don't even remember which year arcade I have.. Edited May 27, 2017 by Topsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2017 (edited) Thanks. I don't do any pedal ups, only bunny hops. Pedal gaps is a different matter though. I like them a lot. As for the Silex... I'll have to wait for @Paperclip to try it out. Edited May 27, 2017 by niconj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyT Posted May 27, 2017 Report Share Posted May 27, 2017 Whats up with that new blue fourplay, it looks lovely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2017 4 hours ago, AndyT said: Whats up with that new blue fourplay, it looks lovely! I know but I really like steel frames. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daviesdt Posted May 28, 2017 Report Share Posted May 28, 2017 Considered getting the arcade over the fourplay (still waiting on the new four play to be released though!) the weight puts me off though, it's a whole kilo heavier. I know weight isnt the be all and end all but that's alot of weight to throw around and unless I have chance to have a go of one before buying it would make me nervous. I've never really been a fan of the whole 'steel is real', started riding aluminium MTB bikes and never gone back to steel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperclip Posted May 28, 2017 Report Share Posted May 28, 2017 1 hour ago, Daviesdt said: Considered getting the arcade over the fourplay (still waiting on the new four play to be released though!) the weight puts me off though, it's a whole kilo heavier. I know weight isnt the be all and end all but that's alot of weight to throw around and unless I have chance to have a go of one before buying it would make me nervous. I've never really been a fan of the whole 'steel is real', started riding aluminium MTB bikes and never gone back to steel. You have to come to terms with it not being the same as a comp bike at the end of the day. The way they get ridden is different you're hindered by the geo for quite a lot of things trials related. The weight of the bike doesn't over come any of that. I've ridden both and although I liked aspects of the Aluminium frame steel just seems to be perfect for street. Even in a trials mindset. It feels great. Around yourself there's a few riders with Arcades and Consoles so getting to a ride and trying one out shouldn't be a problem at all but if you have to not be totally put of by peoples set ups as most run their bars inline with the forks now. Nasty! In terms of the Silex I will let people know what I make of it as soon as I get any inkling of what's actually happening with it, they've told me I am getting one but I don't know if that means they have sent it or not 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 28, 2017 2 hours ago, Paperclip said: inline with the forks now. Nasty! Isn't this the way they are supposed to be ridden on a street setup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperclip Posted May 28, 2017 Report Share Posted May 28, 2017 9 hours ago, niconj said: Isn't this the way they are supposed to be ridden on a street setup? Yeah if you're a fan boy 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, Paperclip said: Yeah if you're a fan boy How do you run your bars? I wouldn't say that I'm a fan boy. I remember asking @Dman how they were supposed to be run and he told me so. Never really thought about it though. Edited May 29, 2017 by niconj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross McArthur Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 @STUNTMAN TERRY runs his forwards with no problems at all. Run what you like Germo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topsy Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Just run them how they're comfortable to you/your wrists.. I don't even know how mine are set up, a bit forwards I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 4 hours ago, Ross McArthur said: @STUNTMAN TERRY runs his forwards with no problems at all. Run what you like Germo. If you don't know, it's good to follow more experienced riders' suggestions. That's what I did. Coming from a pure trials bike, everything about my Inspired felt weird so I never really questioned the bar angle. I thought that this was the best angel as tested by many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dman Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 I used to run them slightly forward, it does help with some stuff, but other stuff feels horrible, inline is right for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Just now, Dman said: I used to run them slightly forward, it does help with some stuff, but other stuff feels horrible, inline is right for me. Examples? I suppose that Bunny Hops are harder with the bars more forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dman Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Can't be arsed, I just like mine inline. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperclip Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 (edited) Mine are forward, my bike usually goes up when I ride towards a wall. All good. Try change them around it'll take a bit of getting used to maybe a ride but it might be the best change to your set up you ever make! Edited May 29, 2017 by Paperclip 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross McArthur Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 The thing with bars in line is, if you ride a Fourplay then change to a Arcade, your bars will feel like they've went forward because of the steeper HA. So its best just to go with what you feel comfortable with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 I find it's still possible to hop ONTO things with bars forwards, but a lot harder to hop OVER things. Tilting them back tucks the elbows in a little more naturally allowing your upper body to relax. Often (not always) bars forwards can stiffen up the riding and force a more elbows out position but it's all personal preference. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 30, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 I tilted them forwards a bit and lifting the front was a lot harder. It felt really weird but I'll give it a try for a longer period of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperclip Posted May 31, 2017 Report Share Posted May 31, 2017 Try the over to one side also, clamp on the upsweep will feel great. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niconj Posted May 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2017 1 hour ago, Paperclip said: Try the over to one side also, clamp on the upsweep will feel great. I have a hard time understanding this. Over to one side? Clamp on the upsweep? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted May 31, 2017 Report Share Posted May 31, 2017 On 2017-5-29 at 5:21 PM, Paperclip said: Mine are forward, my bike usually goes up when I ride towards a wall. All good. Try change them around it'll take a bit of getting used to maybe a ride but it might be the best change to your set up you ever make! That's the thing really, there's no 'right' way to do it, but all I'd say about Luke's setup is that Luke doesn't really ride an Arcade in a way that really gets the most out of one. I don't mean that in a bad way, just that Luke's riding is very much more orientated towards the trials end of the spectrum, so having Carthy bars suits it. Having ridden his bike I can't imagine ever doing a 3 hop or a manual 180 on it because the front end feels so sluggish to carve/move around. Having your bars rolled forwards shifts your weight forwards and that's good for some stuff, but for a lot of streetier stuff you ideally need your weight a bit more neutral/further back, so having your bars like that doesn't really help. If you ride like Luke though it may work for you. If you don't, it probably won't. Having gone from a similar geo Fourplay to an Arcade it was much better in every way, simply because the short stays make it way nicer to bunnyhop, manual and spin, and the steeper head angle makes the whole bike feel more lively and nimble. If that's what you want then go for it. If they're not, they're not. There's not really much point wasting time thinking about hypothetical bar angles for a bike you may or may not get. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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