Pashley26 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) Surely this is worthy of a topic? I have always been very very fussy about what meat I eat, and surely I am not the only person who does not want to eat an animal which has been killed in such a way. To the point that despite my total love for pork (which I obviously know is never going to be Halal meat) I am going far out of my way to source meat from local organic and most importantly non-halal sources. Which has led me to thinking about being vegetarian. On top of that I am a little shocked that big restaurants and chains have been selling Halal meat undeclared to millions of customers. How has this been allowed and gone unnoticed or questioned for so long? Anybody else give a shit? Edited May 8, 2014 by Pashley26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*gentlydoesit Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 So I know very little about halal, I assumed it was like the jewish way?? Though I'd go with.. if you couldn't do it yourself, should you eat it at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted May 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) In short, it's barbaric and not something I agree to having forced upon me. At risk of sticking out like a sore thumb. "The food must come from a supplier that uses halal practices. Specifically, the slaughter must be performed by a Muslim, who must precede the slaughter by invoking the name of Allah, most commonly by saying "Bismillah" ("In the name of God") and then three times "Allahu akbar" (God is the greatest). Then, the animal must be slaughtered with a sharp knife by cutting the throat, windpipe and the blood vessels in the neck (while the animal is conscious), causing the animals death without cutting the spinal cord. Lastly, the blood from the veins must be drained." This link is a fairly neutral source of information about it. http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/food-and-drink/what-is-halal-meat-the-big-questions-about-religious-slaughter-answered-9331519.html I have no issues with religion, I'm very open minded in that sense. My worry is that my own beliefs and freedom to live my life religion free are becoming more and more difficult to carry out without treading on the toes of other practices and beliefs. Edited May 8, 2014 by Pashley26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_Trials Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 If I had to kill animals myself I think I'd end up becoming a vegetarian. I think the halal way of killing an animal is disgusting though, why torture an animal before you eat it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muel Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Lol, barbaric. Halal is far less barbaric than using a bolt gun. Go watch videos of it being done.A far more pressing issue IMO is the horrible lives that animals tend to lead, even when designated "organic".Buy meat from local farms if you're bothered about anything being "barbaric". At least then they're more likely to have lead a semi-decent life before their final 30 seconds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dngr2self Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 This just the latest bit of scare mongering drummed up by the media to sell papers. Like Muel said, check out the stun and bolt gun method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted May 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) It is totally barbaric, what part of slitting an animals throat and letting it bleed to death isn't barbaric? Barbaric by definition means uncivilised and primitive. Which is exactly what I believe this process to be. Stun and bolt guns are instant, zap and the animal is dead. Hence why they are used for slaughter on a mass scale. Slitting an animals throat and letting it bleed to death for nothing other than your own religious benefit? f**kkkk off. Edited May 8, 2014 by Pashley26 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR28 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Mate was in the local Subway the other day and chatted to the guy in there, apparently it's a load of bollocks - probably just made up by some racist idiot on Facebook... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*gentlydoesit Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Yep, sounds a lot like the jewish way. You'd have to trap it, kill it, carve it ect yoyrself. It would be no more 'humane' so I stick to the point that if you couldn't do it should you eat it? The modern way envolves a similar ammount of barberism. depends on your stand point, a prayer is offered so some amount of humanity is involved in the muslim way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muel Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Stun and bolt guns are instant, zap and the animal is dead. Hence why they are used for slaughter on a mass scale.Who says? They're are intensely painful for the animal and often require 2 goes at it.Source being, I've spoken to farmers about it before... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*gentlydoesit Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 ^ that. I used to do the refrig at an abattoir, the guys had 15 mins on and 15 off so they didn't get mind f**ked. I spoke to them about the job because the hours vs wage was great.. I was told the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsbikingnunn Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 to be honest I don't care how the animal will be killed, either way it's going to be killed to be eaten and it doesn't effect the way it tatses. and also stunning the animal doesn't kill it, it paralyses it and then they either break it's neck or cut it's throat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogre Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 my local subway is halal, it's not a problem; instead of the widdly pork sausages they do f**k off turkey burgers instead and the turkey bacon is perfectly fine. slaughtering animals is never pleasant. and as muel said, the prelude to slaughtering can be pretty bad anyway. here's some footage of animals being gassed. is hallal somehow any worse than this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azarathal Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 My worry is that my own beliefs and freedom to live my life religion free are becoming more and more difficult to carry out without treading on the toes of other practices and beliefs. This exactly, I'm all for having different cultures and so on but practically forcing Hallal meat upon others simply to cater to a non-native culture is bollocks, what about the extremists enforcing shariah law in places? Someone I work with is Muslim and we discuss things like this quite often, he even agrees that this country is bending over backwards to follow cultures from all over the world. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD™ Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 If you're living truly religion free, other peoples religions will have absolutely no bearing on your life and nor will the reasons for your food being served to you in a particular way. If you don't want to buy shampoo that's been tested on animals, do your research and then choose one that can prove they haven't. If you don't want to eat meat from animals that have been kept or slaughtered in a certain way, do your research and choose a provider that proves they don't. It's got nothing to do with religion. It's got to do with your general beliefs, and if they limit you in some way then you won't mind because you believe in your beliefs – obviously. Subway are not arseholes for serving halal meat, they're just a company who has made a choice. It's up to the consumer to decide whether they want to accommodate that choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I wonder if the people complaining about it being butchered in this way have ever asked what conditions were like for the animals when they were alive? Are the same people crying about this going to be inquiring about the lives the chickens who laid the eggs the restaurant use had, or the practises used by the dairy farms their milk is sourced from? Pretty much every industry that involves using animals to get us produce of some sort is going to be shady as f**k once you start dipping down to the lower end of the cost range, or indeed if you're buying it from a fast food place where profits are key. If you didn't care before that the reformed chicken meat you were eating came from birds packed from birth into cages with clipped beaks and wings whilst being fed a questionable diet, why would you suddenly care that it's shitty existence was snuffed out in a fractionally different way? If it's just because it's the rules of a different religion, why should that be a problem if it isn't actually 'tampering' with the food in any way? It's interesting that the people posting this up on my FB feed also seem to be the ones who post up any thinly-veiled racism or xenophobia disguised as news, and that their friends who comment on it tend to chat shit along the lines of "If they want to come over here and eat our food, they should put up with how we kill it". With people saying they 'hid' the method of butchering, are they also calling for a piece on the menu to describe how each animal they might consume is actually killed or is it cool to just turn a blind eye to that because it's done 'our' way? Regarding Subway, it's only around 10% of their outlets (the Daily Mail reported that it was "almost 200" stores out of "1500 stores", whereas actually it was 185 stores out of over 1700) that are changing their menus. If they're based in a predominantly Islamic area (which you'd expect it to be in that there was 'high demand' from Muslims to change the menu that was acted upon in those specific areas, rather than it being a national issue) then it probably makes pretty good business sense to do it. Jardo - if you're debating it, just try vegetarianism for a while and see how it works for you. Aside from maybe assuaging some of your meat guilt, it's also a good way to try out some new foods that you wouldn't ordinarily do. I tried it for a bit and had to mix up my cuisine game because it took out a bunch of stuff I'd usually eat, but I found loads of other things I liked as a result. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted May 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) Pretty much agree with what you have said Mark. I have always been very conscious of food sources and livestock conditions, which is why the method of how something is killed affects the type of food I buy. Interesting discussion anyway, from all sides. I work with a Muslim and know his family really well and my girlfriend's best friend is Muslim, and they are all lovely and very respectful. So it puts my back up a bit when I see all this rubbish on Facebook and it stops me talking about it. Like you I have noticed that the voiced reaction is often one of racism or religious focused, rather than positive discussion about alternatives. Edited May 8, 2014 by Pashley26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Dunstan Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) As long as my meat is meaty, I'm not too fussed how the beast died. I do however care that they've had a happy life up until they're killed. Edited May 8, 2014 by Luke Dunstan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzo Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 It doesn't bother me - and if you've ever eaten food in a take away at 3am whilst pissed up, odds are you've eaten Halal meat...where were your morals then? For people who are arsey about it, I think it's more the labelling, or should I say lack of labelling, of such meats that is the issue here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted May 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) And how many Muslims have ended up in the same position? Alcohol isn't Halal... Why follow some of it if not all? The religion side of it interests me, because Muslims will claim it is their right to have Halal meat readily availabe but regularly boycott other parts of their religion which doesn't impact on others. I discussed this with my colleague the other day, a day and he just shrugged it off and said "nobodies perfect fam." Edited May 8, 2014 by Pashley26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dngr2self Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 And how many Muslims have ended up in the same position? Alcohol isn't Halal... Why follow some of it if not all? The religion side of it interests me, because Muslims will claim it is their right to have Halal meat readily availabe but regularly boycott other parts of their religion which doesn't impact on others. I discussed this with my colleague the other day, a day and he just shrugged it off and said "nobodies perfect fam." It's probably just a case of some people liking to be deliberately awkward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 And how many Muslims have ended up in the same position? Alcohol isn't Halal... Why follow some of it if not all? The religion side of it interests me, because Muslims will claim it is their right to have Halal meat readily availabe but regularly boycott other parts of their religion which doesn't impact on others. I discussed this with my colleague the other day, a day and he just shrugged it off and said "nobodies perfect fam." No idea, but I guess it could just be different interpretations of it? Similar to how with Christianity there's a load of different 'levels' of belief, and how much people take on board different parts of the bible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simpson Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I listened to a discussion about this for about an hour in the car (yes my radio is locked to five fecking live) and realised...... I literally could not give a f**k. Halal meat has been prepared for hundreds of years that way and if my chickens dead and tastes the same I really couldnt care less. On yea and.......... MUSLIMS ARE INVADING OUR COUNTRY AND THERE GOING TO BOMB AND TAKE OVER OUR SCHOOLS I mean damn........ Thats what all this is about really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Read: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27324224 In most cases the only difference between halal and not is the animal is blessed. Most halal meat is stunned first. I usually buy more expensive meat mainly because they it tastes better. Cheap chicken is generally full of injected water and a funny pale colour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake. Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Mans gotta eat, couldn't care less how it was killed. Would an animal care how you died? Nope. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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