Willeyeam Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 Recently i bought a second hand trials bike with a rear avid juicy 3 that wasn't preforming great and clearly needed bleeding. As i wanted to ride straight away i swapped my avid juicy 7 over from my DMR. Now each brake is back on the original bike but neither is working properly. The juicy 7 was working perfectly before, it never failed to lock the back wheel under any circumstance but now i can't even brake into a skid. The only thing i did apart from swap the brakes over was realign the pads as, i'm guessing, the brake must have been pulled without the wheel in during swapping them over. It still feels perfect, not at all spongey. The juicy 3 has been bled by my local bike shop and i have fitted new organic pads but after a few hours riding (after braking the pads in) it is still no where near what i would expect. The brake has let me down a couple of times on back wheel maneuvers and is not powerful enough to brake into a skid if my weight is over the back wheel. Any advice on either brake would be great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 Ditch the juicy 3 on the trials bike, what frame is it out of interest? If you have the option maybe fit a rear magura or go for something like a Saint or Magura MT2 if you want to stick with discs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willeyeam Posted June 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 It's a 2011 fourplay so it's disc only. I guess a new brake is a last resort but ideally i would like to get a bit more stopping power out of the 3s if that's possible as money is a bit tight. Thanks for the reply though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dk2 Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 Remove the pads, give them a light sanding(use sandpaper) same with the disc and reinstall....watch out to get anything on the disc...do a few hard stoppings and hopefully you good to go... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willeyeam Posted June 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 I did that with the juicy 7 so maybe it's just a case of doing a few hard stops and letting it bed in again. I cleaned the disk on the juicy 3 before installing the new pads so i shouldn't have to sand that one but i'll try it if nothing else seems to be helping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HippY Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 juicy 3 are very low powered, the reason why I say it because I have them. If you can, move up juicy 7, probably pad bedding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willeyeam Posted June 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 I'm not too worried anymore about the Juicy 7, i tried a few hard stops and it started to improve. But now my front Juicy 3 has lost a lot of power too! I had a good hard ride for a few hours yesterday and it was fine. Admittedly not great but it was about what i would expect. But now while sitting in the garage over night it has lost most of it's stopping power. I'm coming round to the idea that these brakes are pretty shot and a new pair would be a good idea, however i can't really justify spending the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezmtber Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Here are a few checks I do on my brakes. Take the pads out check the pad surface is a dull Matt finish if its polished give it the sand paper. If the pad surface looks dark and loose also give it the sand paper but also leave them on the side and wait ten mins to see if te light dusty surface gets any dark spots. If it does it has oil on the pad if the spots line up with the holes on the back of the pad the came from the brake piston you have a leak. If its random its of the disc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willeyeam Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Thanks Dez, the tip about pad contamination will come in handy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsbikingnunn Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 if i remember correctly juicy 3's have only one moving piston, meaning less stopping power will be transferred into the disc. try going for a hope as they have 2 moving pistons and many street riders use them, or a mechanical avid bb5 or bb7 which are in my opinion the best mechanical disc brake on the market Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Yeah but avids are gash on the rear, be better with a saint or mt2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsbikingnunn Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 but there is no need for a saint on a trials bike, better off with a hope as they are cheaper and work perfectly fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 We will have to agree to disagree on that one, I've found hope's are superb out the box but the second you touch them the performance just goes out the window. 2nd hand pair of Saints for £130-140 however even after a years abuse on a downhill bike are immense. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsbikingnunn Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 i still think hopes are pretty good but if as you've said you can get some second hand saints for the price of brand new hopes then its a no brainer really Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willeyeam Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 (edited) My experience with hopes has been exactly as isitafox said. I bought a pair of mono minis for my DMR and for the first few months they were great, then the problems set in and never went away. Then i bought a rear Juicy 7 (going brakeless on the front) and five years has passed without having a single problem (until now that is, however i think with the 7 it's a case of me not giving a chance for the pads to bed in after sanding and panicking). I still have my pair of minis knocking around the garage actually, i might put them back on although i feel like i'm opening up a can of worms touching those. What are peoples opinions on some more up market avids on a fourplay? I've grown quite partial to my juicy 7 over the years and the 3s being pretty useless hasn't put me off the brand all together. Saints seem to be held in high esteem by everyone and i would love a pair it's just the price. If i start seriously looking for a new pair of brakes i'll start looking for some second hand ones. Edited June 7, 2013 by Willeyeam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 magura mt2's yo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 If you want to stick with Avids have a look here, some good deals 2nd hand http://www.flatoutcycles.co.uk/brakes-7-c.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezmtber Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 if i remember correctly juicy 3's have only one moving piston, meaning less stopping power will be transferred into the disc. try going for a hope as they have 2 moving pistons and many street riders use them, or a mechanical avid bb5 or bb7 which are in my opinion the best mechanical disc brake on the market Tba avid bb brakes have one moving brake pad. All juicys, elixirs have two moving pistons. Older hopes were terible for power. The old mono brakes were horrible. Only since the x2 brakes have hope even been worth considering. Back when hope were crap. I was using avid codes and juicy because those brakes had that same powerful bite the older Hayes hfx9 had Pretty much most new dh brakes have a more powerfull initial bite these days. I find the hope trialzone is the only sharp brake I found without the pads moving around in the caliper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willeyeam Posted June 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Thanks everyone, i've got enough to stew over for now, i'll probably end up buying a used set from flatoutcycles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsbikingnunn Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Tba avid bb brakes have one moving brake pad. All juicys, elixirs have two moving pistons. Older hopes were terible for power. The old mono brakes were horrible. Only since the x2 brakes have hope even been worth considering. Back when hope were crap. I was using avid codes and juicy because those brakes had that same powerful bite the older Hayes hfx9 had Pretty much most new dh brakes have a more powerfull initial bite these days. I find the hope trialzone is the only sharp brake I found without the pads moving around in the caliper. juicy 3's only have one moving piston, i cant find any pictures but you can split the caliper into 2. And i know the avid bb5 and bb7 brakes only have one moving pad too but they in my opinion are really good brakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockman Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 juicy 3's only have one moving piston, i cant find any pictures but you can split the caliper into 2. And i know the avid bb5 and bb7 brakes only have one moving pad too but they in my opinion are really good brakes. No they don't. If they only have one moving piston, explain why both pistons have seals? and why both of them move when you pull the lever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Dark Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 Avid elixir crs on my orange seem really good for what it's worth , far better than my hope mono trials on my old dd koxx anyway Pretty much all the new shimano brakes seem really good, even down to deore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsbikingnunn Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 No they don't. If they only have one moving piston, explain why both pistons have seals? and why both of them move when you pull the lever. yes they do, explain why you can split the caliper into 2 halves and no hydraulic fluid is lost and why there is no bleed nipple on the right hand side of the slave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willeyeam Posted June 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 I just had a look at my juicy 3s and both pistons move. What rotor size would people recommend? I could get a pair of juicy 7s with 203mm rotors but i feel like 203mm is too big, i can't really justify that though i just feel like they are haha. Otherwise i could get some elixir crs for the same price but they don't come with mounts or rotors. Does anyone know if my juicy 3 mounts and rotors will fit them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockman Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 yes they do, explain why you can split the caliper into 2 halves and no hydraulic fluid is lost and why there is no bleed nipple on the right hand side of the slave The caliper splits in 2 so it's easier to service. There is a little hole which connects the two halves of the caliper together, with a little o-ring to seal it. If you genuinely still think you are right, I'll try find one at work tomorrow, strip it and get pictures for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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