Concerning, at present, probably the most important topic of your life

[1a2bcio8]

The notion of this video is that the 'chemtrails' we are releasing, as part of geoengineering (climate engineering), in order to counteract the effects of global warming are accelerating the process to the extent that we might see significant and massive climate events within a year or two. This process of global warming is accelerating the melting of ice masses. These ice masses stop the release of methane which has the potential to jump the effects of global warming massively. If I remember correctly, just 60-70% of one of these pockets has enough methane to kill off either most or all of the planet. This could happen in a matter of years. These facts are established within academia but are not being picked up by the mainstream media because their interfere with the short-term gains of profit. The media usually gains its money through advertising (holidays, cars, etc.) and is usually a part of a conglomerate (part of a larger ownership that ties it to other companies that would lost out, in the short term, from people knowing and acting upon proper information about global warming).

Our world is run by people blinded by their short term self-interest such that they do not make healthy decisions. Most of us allow these decisions to occur because they are masked behind disinformation that makes us confused about what is actually happening. This is also partly because we have become complacent within a relatively easy life. There's no worries about thinking critically because I can simply satisfy myself with this or that shiny piece of technology. I include myself within this criticism. The point here though is not to lay blame but is to say that we either have to adapt or die. All of those things you use to distract yourself are meaningless within the context of such an imminent threat. Please take the time to inform yourself and help inform others about the risk we are at. Inaction will only amount of massive regret and probably death of yourself or someone you love.

Ask yourself what is more important?

[LukasMcNeal]

I haven't got time to watch the video but chemtrails are bullshit. If you understand how a jet engine works and the atmosphere they work in you'll see why there are infact contrails.

[dann2707]

Has Dave changed his username and profile pic?!

What a load of absolute bullshit hahahahaha

[LukasMcNeal]

[1a2bcio8]

Why don't you try actually listening to it - which you possible couldn't have done within the short duration since I posted the video - and then decide upon that rather than dismissing me without a proper consideration?

I am however open to debate and changing my position so why don't you illuminate me on geoengineering please?

[monkeyseemonkeydo]

At work so can't watch the video but why would/how could commercial airlines be doing this? Are they saying the fuel companies are lacing the fuel or what? Sounds like a foil hat conspiracy to me...

[1a2bcio8]

You two are foolish. I've read far too much about what's done in the name of profit and expediency in various other walks of life to dismiss ineptitude due to greed in the area of environment.

[Matt Vandart]

and they are not necessarily commercial jets.

[dann2707]

I've googled the topic and read a few interesting pages about it and I can conclude that it's just another ludicrous conspiracy theory aimed at susceptible people.

Answer me this Ben - I presume you believe the 9/11 attacks might not be what all they seemed too?

It's about time TF got into a "serious" debate, sick of seeing topics about cactus' and shit.

And how you're so adamant about it being truth is quite frankly embarrassing on your behalf

Edited March 7, 2013 by dann2707

[Matt Vandart]

Is he?

It is guaranteed that 911 is not what it seems. I am not saying it was an inside job and all that shit but there are many unanswered questions.

I've googled the topic and read a few interesting pages about it and I can conclude that it's just another ludicrous conspiracy theory aimed at susceptible people.

Phew, I can rest easy now knowing it has been fully and impartially investigated, thanks dude!

[1a2bcio8]

I am open to the idea that the American government wilfully allowed it to happen but I don't feel the need to say for certain. Having spent much time reading about American foreign policy in Latin American, the Middle East, etc. and the atrocities carried out under it - which is not a conspiracy theory but comes from a broad range of fact - it wouldn't surprise me that they would allowed it to happen for expediency. The trouble is people view foreign policy in terms of the mainstream media which a quick analysis shows to be massively biased toward minority interests. Necessarily this distorts our view of the world.

Regarding something like the topic at hand, reading into and watching documentaries concerning, say, meat production or fracking shows that vested interests hide the extremely negative realities of what they are doing. It's not a difficult leap to assume the same for this topic. For instance, it was revealed recently that there is a group of millionaires or billionaires have been funding climate change disinformation. It's not difficult to find this type of information unless you don't look or restrict yourself to the BBC or something similar.

I don't buy into the illuminate or anything akin to that but I do subscribe to the notion that people are greedy and will do an all manner of insane and stupid things as a result.

[1a2bcio8]

I guess, also, that nobody paid attention to the fact that this is supposedly common knowledge in academia? I appreciate we have to trust this man's say so but, none the less, that being the case, does this not bring any kind of questioning to the foreground?

[Topsy]

I like how so many go 'meh' when the topic gets shared on the internet but if it would be in our stupid media everybody would go apesh!t.. Obviously they would not want that to happen. Would be a nuissance wouldn't it? *cough* >.<

Now, I'm not very far into the video, but it definately sounds sh*t and goes hand in hand with what I notice when looking out.. (obv.^^)

[1a2bcio8]

C'mon Lukas and Dan. Please tell me in a reasonable fashion, rather than a single dismissive sentence, why the points raised in the topic video are invalid?

Anyone can saying "What a load of absolute bullshit hahahahaha"; even, probably, a parrot.

[dann2707]

I am open to the idea

reading into and watching documentaries

Bang on the money there I'd say. It seems these types of videos and conspiracy theories always seem to target the same people over and over again on here. You, Dave, Matt V and that guy who does media/photography (profile pic is him next to a wall on a bike with a few others angled from the side) for example.

I will admit through the summer holidays when I broke up for year 11 I had ALOT of time on my hands and I ended up looking into the 9/11 conspiracy theories and I did end up believing it kind of, I'll admit that. But when I went further in and went onto the forums I realised just how crazy the claims were (Smoke flumes being attached to the building to create smoke screens as there wasn't actually a fire?!). I soon snapped out of it.

I know this isn't about 9/11 but my point still stands.

[Matt Vandart]

Just because some of it is bullshit, doesn't mean it is all bullshit

[dann2707]

The first piece of information I come across massively contradicts hard evidence?

From conspiracy site:

Normal contrails usually dissipate very rapidly, are of relatively short length, and show variability in their formation from the engines. Chemtrails usually extend continuously and expand to transform into a cirrus type cloud layer. Apart from the repeated, intense, and unusual flight-patterns, odd illnesses will sometimes strike people shortly after these chemtrail episodes; multiple witnesses have also reported a cobweb-like substance seen falling from the sky.

From a journal of atmospheric science:

Contrails are formed when hot humid air from the engines mixes with the colder surrounding air. The rate at which contrails dissipate is entirely dependent on weather conditions and altitude. If the atmosphere is near saturation, the contrail may exist for some time. Conversely, if the atmosphere is dry, the contrail will dissipate quickly.^[4]

It is well established by atmospheric scientists that persistent contrails not only can persist for hours, but it is a perfectly normal characteristic for them to spread out into cirrus sheets. Contrails between 25,000 and 40,000 feet can often merge into an "almost solid" interlaced sheet.^[20] Contrails can have a lateral spread of several kilometers, and given sufficient air traffic it is possible for contrails to create an entirely overcast sky which increases the ice budget of individual contrails and persists for hours.

If "they" can't even get science right, what's stopping "them" from bullshitting or bending the "truth" to you?

Edited March 7, 2013 by dann2707

[LukasMcNeal]

I dismiss it because there has been research into contrails for coming up to 90 years now. They are because of combustion and the humidity/pressure of the air. There has been loads of NASA research into them too which has proven this. We know why cars produce exhaust right?

[Matt Vandart]

Excellent.

[1a2bcio8]

Conspiracy is one of those emotive words people have been conditioned to apply and react emotively to. You apply it to such and such an idea and then you dismiss it there and then. It denies allowing an idea a reasonable chance. Just as we can get into the habit of believing too much we can also get into the habit of dismissing too much.

I am not espousing a conspiracy theory though. I usually read political science and environmental science that is based upon facts. In the area of politics, we can gain a pretty good idea of what happens in the political world of government against what appears in the mainstream media (and therefore the view most people have) by looking at declassified government documents. For example then, certain declassified notes from Blair's time in government tell us that he and his cabinet were well aware of the fact Iraq didn't have any WMD's and discussed how they could justify an invasion. Looking into the reality painted of Latin America by the mainstream American media when they hold a dictator to be a stellar example of democracy, we see the downplaying of atrocities (rapes, torture, murder, etc.) against the reports of NGOs (Non-governmental organisations such as charities, academics, etc.) differing significantly - the latter tends to report these awful happenings. The reverse is true of countries that do not comply with our desire to give access to their resources and out media demonise them again, again, an range of contrary reports arising from organisations that do not share the interests of government and big interest.

The mainstream media is always owned by big business. This means there is instantly a bias toward whomever owns the paper. If the media exists within a conglomerate if relates to other businesses whose interests it will not interfere with. Furthermore, newspapers and television news makes its money through advertising; therefore it cannot properly report against those who pay it. Systematic and scientific analysis of mainstream media shows that they mostly interview people involved in business and government for their views on current affairs therefore skewing our interpretation of things to what serves those groups. There are a multitude of other reasons but these are pretty sufficient to make my point that there is a reality that serves 'power' (not the illuminate or something like that). Media that exists not for profit tends to paint a different picture of the world.

Calling something a conspiracy and leaving it at that is just being lazy.

[Revolver]

For me the thing about this kind of stuff is that there's evidence for, and they really drive it hard in this kind of video, but there's also evidence against. Now, a foil hat would say that the evidence against is bullshit that's being fed to you, but it could equally be true for the evidence for, which creates a bit of a dilemma because for the same reasons, you can't believe either of them.

Edited March 7, 2013 by Revolver

[monkeyseemonkeydo]

I guess, also, that nobody paid attention to the fact that this is supposedly common knowledge in academia?

From Wikipedia (which calls this the 'chemtrail conspiracy theory' by the way), which we know is the source of all knowledge in the world:

This theory is not accepted by the scientific community, which states that they are just normal contrails, as there is no scientific evidence supporting the chemtrail theory.

[ooo]

Its naive to think people won't do something for money and power. But I'm not convinced about the how and why of what this guy is talking about. However whatever is going on is certainly in full swing, the earth is changing anyone measuring geological change is seeing huge changes from the atmosphere to the sea to the balance of eco-systems.

Whatever is happening is bad for us, and it's important to remember that the earth has only been inhabitable to humans for a relatively short time. The day that every person is willing to say hands down that the earth is becoming inhabitable it will be to late to reverse.

Its important for us to keep an open mind, because the science of this field is complex underfunded and on such a huge scale that it's very difficult to model mathematically.

[Greetings]

One of my friends keeps posting sightings of "cropduster" planes on Facebook, which he thinks fly at night and spray us all with chemicals.

[Matt Vandart]

From Wikipedia (which calls this the 'chemtrail conspiracy theory' by the way), which we know is the source of all knowledge in the world:

Its naive to think people won't do something for money and power. But I'm not convinced about the how and why of what this guy is talking about. However whatever is going on is certainly in full swing, the earth is changing anyone measuring geological change is seeing huge changes from the atmosphere to the sea to the balance of eco-systems.

Whatever is happening is bad for us, and it's important to remember that the earth has only been inhabitable to humans for a relatively short time. The day that every person is willing to say hands down that the earth is becoming inhabitable it will be to late to reverse.

Its important for us to keep an open mind, because the science of this field is complex underfunded and on such a huge scale that it's very difficult to model mathematically.