Trials-Mikey Posted February 26, 2013 Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 hi guys thinking about a jaf build and had a drawing sent to me i have been playing about with brakeless mod for a while and would like something that spins easier and manuals nice but will also do some tgs. basically needing thoughts on the geometry that i am thinking of basically will this feel nicer than my old echo team 09.Also need ideas on colors following spec. trialtech black 4-bolts trialtech sport black stem white monty kenny belaey bars silver onza cranks white trialtech magnesium pedals black echo rims black trialtech hubs red rimtape ti bolts any help would be appreciated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted February 26, 2013 Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 Black would look nice. Geo sounds alright too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trials-Mikey Posted February 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 Is there anything i could do to the geo to make it ride better ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezmtber Posted February 26, 2013 Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 Ferrari red if you want something different Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted February 26, 2013 Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 Is there anything i could do to the geo to make it ride better ? You can not make it ride better, only differently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted February 26, 2013 Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 Geo sounds pretty nice to me:) May I ask why you have a headangle of 73 degrees? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aener Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 (edited) Geo sounds pretty nice to me:) May I ask why you have a headangle of 73 degrees? Because that's the only headangle worth having It reins in the front wheel whilst giving the same reach, meaning it's not cramped and you get sharper steering, which in turn carves in to spins better. It's also nicer for frenchies as you don't have to rotate as far around the front axle to get the bounce since it's already closer to being underneath you. Lets you wodge slightly smaller obstacles, and whilst it takes a while to adjust to initially getting the bike higher, it helps with hooks since you're positioned higher over the corner of the wall when you hit it. I can't really comment on front-gaps as I've only had it brakeless, but I can't see how it would make them any worse... In my mind, it seems like it should even make them easier to pin down and switch through - but that's a guess.My frames geometry is 73*, 595, 350, +70, 980 and is awesome with a 165x35* stem. (I'm 5'9".)She's a bit biased toward street though - sidehops are a bit awkward - so a little longer might work out well if you want to be a little less street-inclined and more trialsy.618 is a fairly large reach though, so I'd definitely recommend a 150mm stem and having the bars rolled back. As it stands, that geo and listed spec should ride pretty damned nice, but do spend a while playing with bar angles to get it settled - a few degrees back/forward can make a huge difference.It all depends on where you want it to lie on the street:TGS continuum Edit: Just a point for anyone else that might be looking at getting a Jaf frame made... Spare some consideration for the guy and ask these sorts of questions BEFORE getting a quote. If you're still really unsure, you don't need a diagram Drawing frames up takes time! Edited February 27, 2013 by aener 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradJohnson Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Geo sounds spot on for spins and tgs stuff! Only thing i'd say is get some brake mounts, just incase you decide you want to throw the brakes back on. Also matte purple/ metalic lime green! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Because that's the only headangle worth having This Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Because that's the only headangle worth having It reins in the front wheel whilst giving the same reach, meaning it's not cramped and you get sharper steering, which in turn carves in to spins better. It's also nicer for frenchies as you don't have to rotate as far around the front axle to get the bounce since it's already closer to being underneath you. Lets you wodge slightly smaller obstacles, and whilst it takes a while to adjust to initially getting the bike higher, it helps with hooks since you're positioned higher over the corner of the wall when you hit it. I can't really comment on front-gaps as I've only had it brakeless, but I can't see how it would make them any worse... In my mind, it seems like it should even make them easier to pin down and switch through - but that's a guess. Thanks Flipp, that's the sort of explanation I wanted That does sound like a awesome headangle, why haven't I seen it on any mass produced frame though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 If anything head angles have been getting slacker though I think this is down to the fact it makes it easier to tap an object. There are some pioneers trying to change this though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew62 Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Thanks Flipp, that's the sort of explanation I wanted That does sound like a awesome headangle, why haven't I seen it on any mass produced frame though? You have....on every Inspired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aener Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Because not many people want a streety mod. If they want street, they get a BMX. If they want trials, they get a normal mod. A slacker head angle means a longer wheelbase for the same reach, and a longer wheelbase makes the bike more stable/less twitchy. For trials this is good, but for agility it's bad. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross McArthur Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 You have....on every Inspired. Not every Inspired (meaning the ones Ali, Mark and Sean are testing) The older silver and black/red Ashtons had 73 HA too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Though with more bikes being used as pogo sticks now it's surprising they don't use it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew62 Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 why haven't I seen it on any mass produced frame though? See...mass produced frame..... You have....on every Inspired. Not every Inspired (meaning the ones Ali, Mark and Sean are testing) The older silver and black/red Ashtons had 73 HA too. I was referring only to Inspireds in mass production...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 You have....on every Inspired. I was more aiming that towards mod's:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trials-Mikey Posted February 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Because that's the only headangle worth having It reins in the front wheel whilst giving the same reach, meaning it's not cramped and you get sharper steering, which in turn carves in to spins better. It's also nicer for frenchies as you don't have to rotate as far around the front axle to get the bounce since it's already closer to being underneath you. Lets you wodge slightly smaller obstacles, and whilst it takes a while to adjust to initially getting the bike higher, it helps with hooks since you're positioned higher over the corner of the wall when you hit it. I can't really comment on front-gaps as I've only had it brakeless, but I can't see how it would make them any worse... In my mind, it seems like it should even make them easier to pin down and switch through - but that's a guess. My frames geometry is 73*, 595, 350, +70, 980 and is awesome with a 165x35* stem. (I'm 5'9".) She's a bit biased toward street though - sidehops are a bit awkward - so a little longer might work out well if you want to be a little less street-inclined and more trialsy. 618 is a fairly large reach though, so I'd definitely recommend a 150mm stem and having the bars rolled back. As it stands, that geo and listed spec should ride pretty damned nice, but do spend a while playing with bar angles to get it settled - a few degrees back/forward can make a huge difference. It all depends on where you want it to lie on the street:TGS continuum Edit: Just a point for anyone else that might be looking at getting a Jaf frame made... Spare some consideration for the guy and ask these sorts of questions BEFORE getting a quote. If you're still really unsure, you don't need a diagram Drawing frames up takes time! if i changed the length of the downtube to make it shorter would it ride nicer and also would it still side hop nice and not be akward i am also running a 165x35 stem so how would that work ?? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross McArthur Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 If you shorten the length of the downtube your head angle will be very steep and wheel base shorter. I dont think thats what you're after... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben_travis Posted February 27, 2013 Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 (edited) also Mikey, the length shown on your diagram that is sort of parallel with the downtube isnt the downtube length...just making sure you know that is the 'reach' (centre of bb to centre top of headtube) Edited February 27, 2013 by ben_travis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trials-Mikey Posted February 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2013 Thanks ross and ben that helped me alotThanks ross and ben that helped me alot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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