Noob Advice Requested Please...

[knave]

I love bikes, I ride motorbikes and push bikes all year round but I’ve never tried trials, always fancied it so I’m a noob about to buy my first trials bike and I’m looking for advice. I’ve been researching the topic recently to try to establish what I should buy. Money isn’t really an issue but I’m not inclined to spend a lot on a bike I’m not 100% about (I’d like to think I will get into it but can’t really be sure) and I also wouldn’t appreciate a “good” bike anyway so I thought I’d buy a second hand/entry level bike to get me started and take it from there. My research has shown that 20” is what I should be looking at for the type of riding I’m interested in.

Coming from predominantly a mountain bike background, the general wisdom in that field is that if you aren’t spending loads, then buy a bike that has a good frame that you will be able to upgrade when appropriate. I’m looking for similar broad guidance in terms of my first trials bike - what I’d find really helpful is a list of “definitely avoid if it has this…” and “do try to get one that has this…” kind of pointers.

I’m happy to admit to have been a bit baffled by all the trials stuff like the “front freewheel”, including the different gauge of freewheel which is something I’ve never thought about before – this is the kind of thing I really want advice on because I’m sure this is quite important but as a noob I would never have realised. If someone could throw me a bone on a make/model of bike to look out for that would be great.

Any help/advice/pointers/recommendations/links/etc greatly appreciated

[AndrewEH1]

Buying second hand off here would be a good start - there's no point in buying new if you are unsure especially as trials bikes lose about 40% value straight away. Have a look at the 'For Sale' section and see what takes your fancy.

Have you thought about 26"? If you are riding mountain bikes getting a trials bike with the same wheel size might help, but as you might have seen people are usually able to progress 'quicker' on a smaller, lighter 20".

On mountain bikes the freewheel is usually built into the rear hub, whereas in competition trials (20" and 26" - general sweeping statement I know) the freewheel is moved to the BB, it usually screws onto the left crank, to help centralise the weight on the bike creating a front freewheel, or FFW. The more engagements the better!

As for buying a bike, you are right in saying that getting a better frame and upgrading parts is a better way of doing it. I'd suggest looking at Echo or Onza but there are lots of brands.

The geometry of the frame will effect your riding, so hopefully someone more clued up about that will be along shortly

Edited August 1, 2012 by AndrewEH1

[mr_malcolm]

If your a mountain biker i might suggest starting on a 26 as you will feel more at home in it to start with and if you avoid a front freewheel and look for something with a hope pro2 rear hub as maintenance etc will be what your used to. Each to their own but when i used to ride i started on a 20" (mod) a t-pro 04 or 05 i think it was and i could never really get comfy on it, i then switched to a 26" ( stock) but an older model a giant team trials with a more mountain bike geometry instead of having a high bottom bracket and I found this helped boost my confidence and comfort 10 fold. Although i no longer ride I would recommend trying to find some riders in your area that you could speak with and see if any will let you have a little try on their bikes as there are so many makes and models all with their own geo so you need to find something that feels right.

At first it can feel like everything is really un natural and takes forever to learn but over time things just click into place and you don't even realise how much you have learned.

[BradJohnson]

Welcome to the forum, glad that you can actually spell unlike some of the other newbees.

I'd reccomend getting a bike with a front freewheel, personally i'd get one with an echo SL 108 click.

This is because the engadements are almost instant and you wont be taking any slack up like you would with a cheap freewheel.

so all the power you put into the cranks will instanly make you move, this is a good point because it enables you to gap bigger and learn bigger moves easier.

Secondly i would reccomend getting a set of good brakes, Magura HS33/HS11 with a set of good pads, heatsink pads, cousts, Tnn are all good pads.

A grind on the rim would also help the brake, this makes the surface rough and makes a nice surface for the pads to grip too.

Vee brakes can also be equally good and maguras, if the have a good set of pads as stated above, and a good set of shimano/ avid callipers.

Disc brakes are also very good brakes if set up right.

People like hope mono brakes but i prefer shimano deore 2012 they work very well and are a lot cheaper than hopes.

Hope this helps.

[knave]

Thanks for taking the time to post some pointers, much appreciated.

Whilst a 26” would probably seem more “usual” to me, I actually want a 20” BECAUSE it will be different (as well as the other advantages). I know this is a bit weird but I like diversity in my riding – the mod will feel very different from my 26” full susser which also feels quite different from my Yamaha Fazer - I love the diversity of riding bikes, what can I say. It excites me to think about riding a bike which is totally alien. It’s a sickness, I know.

Anyway, with your help I’m on the hunt now but being a little frustrated by all the ebay listings being “collection only” – I’ve been watching a few options and waiting to see if they sell, if they don’t, I intend messaging the seller and asking if, given they haven’t had success with collection only, if they would sell to me shipped. Can someone a bit more savvy than me about ebay answer this question please: If they say “yes I can” – If I ask them to relist it as a “buy it now” is there any way to set it up to ensure that only I can buy it? I don’t think there is so I’m slightly concerned about arranging this and someone jumps in and bags it before me.

Thanks again for all the advice.

[mr_malcolm]

if they're willing to do it then you may have to do it outside of ebay like via pay pal but make sure you mark it as payment for goods so as to protect yourself. Couriers for bikes aren't normally very cheap you'll be looking at between £20 - £30 im sure if you arrange it and pay for it then no one will have an issue with doing it. Have a look on here as well in the for sale section lots of decent bikes around and you may get something slightly better.

As has been said things to look for include magura hydraulic rim breaks or disk brakes, V's work fine providing you know how to set one up perfectly and keep it adjusted. look for something with a 19" rear wheel i do believe most mods of all levels come with these near enough, keep an eye out for Onza T-pro's they're generally an ideal bike to start out on as they aren't to expensive, pretty reliable and easily upgradable.

[Dan_Trials]

The first thing that comes to my mind is that you can do trailsy stuff on any bike. I get the feeling that you have been riding bikes for a while so maybe you have an old rigid frame (the smaller the better) and some parts kicking about some where? Perhaps you could build this up with some cheap parts, rigid or short travel forks etc. It won't be ideal and I know you were aiming for 20", but if you just want a taster of trials and don't want to spend too much at first this is a good option.

[ogre]

a proper trials bike will help, if you fancy some light reading this thread has alot of useful stuff on getting into trials, with regards to a bike, there are some things you should aim to acquire cause there is a degree of advantage from having the right hardware from the start, i used to sing the praises of learning to appreciate the difference of better parts as you replace your shit ones, but i watched a new-to-trials rider with a brand new echo lite progress faster than i ever imagined possible... so good gear really makes a difference...

when you look at buying a bike you want to make sure it has the following features:

front freewheel

isis cranks (because they're stiffer and more reliable)

sealed bearings on as many parts as possible

alloy forks (cheap bikes come with steel forks, they feel horible and make the bike less nimble)

quality brakes, or be prepared to buy some high end pads ASAP

trials frames are all pretty good, just avoid anything to light (rockmans and koxxes) as they're a bit delicate and your guna be giving it some abuse, likewise don't get anything to old or battered...

[knave]

Thanks for these responses (Ogre: I was monitoring that thread as it was unfolding), mega helpful. I really appreciate it.

What a cracking forum. I've picked up all this info and now have a trials bike (also via this forum!) in the garage waiting for it to stop raining. I've strapped the L-plates on it and now have to start the at the bottom and see what happens but thank you for getting me on my way.

[mr_malcolm]

awsome man lets hope you enjoy it and get stuck into the sport. even if you find its not for you the chit chat part of this forum is always worth staying for.

[Dan_Trials]

Good stuff man, hope you enjoy it!

[knave]

Thanks, I need to try to get regular time in on the trials now because I'm really starting from rock bottom here - I can probably track stand my FZ6 at lights longer than I can the trials bike at the moment so I think it's time spent on my drive for the foreseeable just trying to get the basic foundations in place. The missus still thinks it's hilarious that I've bought a bike with no seat so at least someone's enjoying it! lol

[Dan_Trials]

Yeah that's just try get as much time on it as possible, and the great thing about trials is you don't really need to go any where, if you have a spare 10/20 minutes just hop about out side your house (or inside!).

[knave]

Quick question - I have a disc on the front and HS33 on the back - will the back turn to piss if they get wet? I've never used modern rim brakes, last time I had them was on MTB back in the early 90s and they were useless in the wet. I'm looking to spend a few hours on the bike on Sunday but it's going to be raining so I've been wondering.

[Dan_Trials]

It's a very personal thing and really you just have to try different set ups to see what you prefer. As a general guide:

A well set up brake will always work better.

A rim grind will improve wet weather performance.

There are different pad compounds for a smooth or ground rim, wet or dry conditions in various combinations.

The feel of the brake at the lever seems to have a mental effect on how well it is working at the wheel. One person can find a brake to be amazing and get on fine with it while another can find the same brake to be spongy and useless.

Some bleed their's with water and/or antifreeze. Magura do their own fluid called Royal Blood. You can use LHM (Citroen suspension fluid) too.

You can get 'brake boosters' to reduce frame flex (some frames have a built in booster).

Bear in mind also that in trials you want a brake that is good at stopping the rear wheel turning backwards too.

There is a rim grind tutorial video on TartyBikes and also in the product description for the pads it indicates what rim finish and weather the pad is best suited to.

Hope this helps but at the end of the day you just need to try different things to see what you prefer.

[bing]

what disk brake are you running dude? and what pads have you got in your hs33? if you want a cheap good recommendation, get the neon 2012 tie fighter pads. just as good as heatsink yellows at a 3rd of the price. that's running a medium grind.