Kieran Morrison Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 If there is 2 or 3 people in one video, do they all have to contact the email adress individually or can all of their information be sent in one email? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skoze Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 Judging question, how will the music be judged? I know this is probably a tricky one but is it more to do with the quality of the song or more in terms of how it works with in the context of the video? I imagine it'll be hard to judge since judges will have their personal preferences. Should I be studying judges videos to guarantee they'll hear a song they'll like? I'd have thought that as long as it works with the video you'll be fine - like, you wouldn't have a chilled summery video to the soundtrack of Slayer or something (unless you're Judders) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Rainbird Posted June 29, 2012 Report Share Posted June 29, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greetings Posted July 24, 2012 Report Share Posted July 24, 2012 Regarding the judging, for the novice category at least, myself, Mark Westlake, Inspired and Phoenix Riders Co will be judging. I'd like to make a point. Not sure who Phoenix riders are but you, Mark and Inspired riders could be a bit biased towards the street trials style of riding? I can kind of understand why you guys could be a good choice for the jury, after all you're very creative with your riding and that's partly what this comp is about but I can't help feel that you'll be more impressed by a style of riding similar to your own than by normal trials moves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Swales Posted July 24, 2012 Report Share Posted July 24, 2012 Ben asked me/us at Tribal Zine to judge the entries as well, and we're coming from a much more 'trialsy' background, which should hopefully even things out on that front. Not that I feel they'd need evening out though - everyone who's judging is professional and fair, so I'm sure there won't be any problems. Also, Phoenix Riders Co. is the company name, so the judges are Mark Westlake, Inspired Bicycles (the compnay), Phoenix Riders Co. (the company) and whoever else, not those companies' riders - wasn't sure whether you'd understood that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1a2bcio8 Posted July 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 24, 2012 (edited) Fortunately that's why people like Ben Swales, Adam Read (although I think I may have forgotten to ask him) will be judging. There will probably be others of a similar background also involved but I need to ask them I've also decided that I won't be judging. However, I will mostly be choosing creative (invariably street) riders to judge because this is what the competition is mostly about. It is open to more traditional styles but, as already stated, they are unlikely to do well unless they make a movement toward a more creative style. I'll reiterate it again that the comp isn't really designed to satisfy all styles of riding. Pragmatic or functional riding will not really achieve very well against creative riding. edit: also to state again that there are easy examples of more traditional or more pure forms of trials riding that are used in creative ways with riders such as Stan Shaw, Jack Meek and Rowan Johns. The judges I'm sure will be open and appreciative of this sort of creative style. At the very least I'll be specifying that they should be. I'm also choosing judges based on a trust about their character. It's never going to be perfect but then what is perfect in a system of subjective individuals? Edited July 24, 2012 by Ben Rowlands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greetings Posted July 24, 2012 Report Share Posted July 24, 2012 It's never going to be perfect but then what is perfect in a system of subjective individuals? Doesn't have to be, you've clearly stated what you're looking for and in that case being biased doesn't really matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR28 Posted July 24, 2012 Report Share Posted July 24, 2012 Adam Read (although I think I may have forgotten to ask him) You're right there Happy to do it though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skoze Posted July 24, 2012 Report Share Posted July 24, 2012 I'd like to make a point. Not sure who Phoenix riders are but you, Mark and Inspired riders could be a bit biased towards the street trials style of riding? That's sorta the idea of this comp though? I can see where you're coming from, but in knowing those who've been picked to judge i can safely say it's in good hands - each and every one of them appreciates things way beyond manuals and a few spins - the only way you'd really get discredited would be if you did a strict tgs vid - but then leading back to my first point that's not really what this is for. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted July 25, 2012 Report Share Posted July 25, 2012 If all a video is is someone just repeatedly doing footjam whips or those 360 tyre-tap off things on a variety of setups they'd get 'discredited' too. I get just as bored watching unimaginative 'street' videos as I do watching unimaginative 'trials' videos. I'm not more "impressed" by one style of riding over another, I'm "impressed" by difference and creativity. That difference can come about in any type of riding, whether it's 'BMX' or trials. For example, one of my favourite riders is still Rowan because he just looks at everything differently and comes up with new lines all the time. Obviously having a sweet style is a nice kicker in that sense, but it's his way of looking at things that stands out to me most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miles Mallinson Posted July 26, 2012 Report Share Posted July 26, 2012 Might actually get round to filming some stuff in the next few days now the weather is being nice. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich J Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 Something I would think a good judging point, someone who is not a rider, but knows what is technically good and also visually, as it's all about creativity perhaps someone who can sit outside from the trials aspect of the video and watch it for what it is. I'm in this position (god knows why I am on here) and watch alot of videos with that view, and I am not suggesting myself, but someone with no ties and can watch a video and say that was cool opposed to that was only 6 inches kinda affair I think would be a good addition to the panel. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eskimo Posted August 2, 2012 Report Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) Something I would think a good judging point, someone who is not a rider, but knows what is technically good and also visually, as it's all about creativity perhaps someone who can sit outside from the trials aspect of the video and watch it for what it is. I'm in this position (god knows why I am on here) and watch alot of videos with that view, and I am not suggesting myself, but someone with no ties and can watch a video and say that was cool opposed to that was only 6 inches kinda affair I think would be a good addition to the panel. To be honest, but harsh, i don't think most riders can decipher between what moves are harder than others. The current judge listing for the novice category is very mixed. There are also strict guidelines to adhere to/ take note of. People will be most at a disadvantage if they aren't to read and take note of the reasoning behind the competition, unless of course they aren't too concerned about winning. I have a feeling that many non-entrants will be surprised by the outcome in the end. [edit] And this is all being said before entrants have even released their footage. Edited August 2, 2012 by eskimo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted August 2, 2012 Report Share Posted August 2, 2012 I can definitely see the logic in having a non-rider to judge the sort of 'goodness' of the video itself, but at the same time almost every riding video I've ever seen made by someone who doesn't ride hasn't really been that good. Same as when you get non-riders trying to photograph riding and you just get weird crops, random timing, 'interesting' angles, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Harrison Posted August 2, 2012 Report Share Posted August 2, 2012 It's not like I'm about to enter this or anything, but if I did, then having been riding for 13 years but not being sponsored, I'd be confused about which category to enter. After all, I wouldn't class myself as a novice. You may like to clarify this - like with Mark's reply on the first page - I mean, he'd hardly enter novice either, see? Look forward to seeing the entries... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1a2bcio8 Posted August 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) Something I would think a good judging point, someone who is not a rider, but knows what is technically good and also visually, as it's all about creativity perhaps someone who can sit outside from the trials aspect of the video and watch it for what it is. I'm in this position (god knows why I am on here) and watch alot of videos with that view, and I am not suggesting myself, but someone with no ties and can watch a video and say that was cool opposed to that was only 6 inches kinda affair I think would be a good addition to the panel. It's an interesting idea but I don't think entirely practical. Individuals who have developed an eye for riding, so to speak, are preferable. The eye that allows them to pick up various subtleties that the inexperienced won't. It's not like I'm about to enter this or anything, but if I did, then having been riding for 13 years but not being sponsored, I'd be confused about which category to enter. After all, I wouldn't class myself as a novice. You may like to clarify this - like with Mark's reply on the first page - I mean, he'd hardly enter novice either, see? Look forward to seeing the entries... The differing categories are not rigid. They are an initial guide to separate differing levels of riding. I did kind of imply this before although I didn't exactly make it clear. Some riders with some degree of sponsorship can still enter in the novice category and some riders without sponsorship will be placed in the sponsored category. People who are borderline I've discussed with them where we think they should go. If I'm unsure because I don't know them I've assumed their honesty and allowed them the opportunity to decide. I'd happily move someone into a different category after seeing their entry if I felt it was definitely inappropriately placed. The initial point though is that the 'best' riders whom often have sponsorship are definitely excluded from the novice category to give the latter a chance of winning prizes for their efforts. It's a difficult situation but I guess that's the nature of imposing simple concepts/categories onto a more complex reality. Edited August 2, 2012 by Ben Rowlands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich J Posted August 2, 2012 Report Share Posted August 2, 2012 I wasn't suggesting a non rider as such, more a non trials rider. But I do agree with the points made, I just felt it would open up a new angle of judging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Nichols Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 I think it's pretty clear, if you have a sponsor you enter the sponsored category. Everyone else enters the novice (unsponsored) category. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Harrison Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 It was that apparent crystal clarity which prompted my post. As above Ben says otherwise ; ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Nichols Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 Ahhh, it appears I was clutching the wrong end of the stick very firmly indeed I actually thought the whole reason for the divide was that it was a little unfair that someone who doesn't pay for their shit has the option of swiping prizes from someone who has to buy everything themselves. It is a competition though I guess, so fair do's! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1a2bcio8 Posted August 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 Ahhh, it appears I was clutching the wrong end of the stick very firmly indeed I actually thought the whole reason for the divide was that it was a little unfair that someone who doesn't pay for their shit has the option of swiping prizes from someone who has to buy everything themselves. It is a competition though I guess, so fair do's! That's an important part of it but there are some people who receive minimal forms of sponsorship and their riding is at a level where, to be honest, it would be unfair to place them against the riders that have greater sponsorship and whose level of riding is clearly higher. Receiving just brake pads, a t-shirt or something along those lines doesn't really place someone in a significantly more materially rewarded position than people without anything. Ultimately though, yeah, it's about what seems fairer. I'm open to criticism, suggestions, etc. about the method and am willing to make changes if some clear problems of fairness are recognised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Nichols Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 I was sort of playing devils advocate to be honest, it's impossible to be 100% 'fair', especially as fairness is subjective. I think the way you've done it is fine, using a bit of discretion is always a lot better than the black and white approach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Harrison Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 Makes sense, about sponsored riders being less in need of prizes. My point was that some non-sponsored riders are better than some sponsored riders. Plus I wouldn't call Mark a 'novice'. Or maybe I will... ; ) As above though, look forward to seeing the videos - I think this kind of competition is good for the sport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Papasnap Maher Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 What is the crack with editing of the videos...because Euan hasnt edited his vid...Id imagine Doney didnt...Shrewsbury will get Jonny Jones to do his.. Im just confused?? Can i go and hire a some famdem with bare skillz to film and edit a video for me?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD™ Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 What is the crack with editing of the videos...because Euan hasnt edited his vid...Id imagine Doney didnt...Shrewsbury will get Jonny Jones to do his.. Im just confused?? Can i go and hire a some famdem with bare skillz to film and edit a video for me?? I'd have thought you can use whatever resources you have available - if you happen to know someone awesome at editing that will do it for free then great. If you want to spend the money on someone filming and editing it then great too, but if that's just to win prizes then it seems a bit of a silly risk... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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