matt.price Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 hi i have finally decided that i want to water bleed my rear maggies after reading about how popular it is on this website. but i need to perswade my dad ( and myself a lil more) that i should. also what do i have to do to stop the brake having any problems? ( apart from the obv i.e cross over split etc.) any help would be great. also can you post if you have water , do you like it and why , and do you have any problems? thanks matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris4stars Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 3 pages of chat about it, and my opinion is somewhere within it http://www.trials-forum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=151693 that was the only one i noticed on the first page, im sure there are plenty of topics you could show to your dad to help persuade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt.price Posted May 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 3 pages of chat about it, and my opinion is somewhere within it http://www.trials-forum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=151693 that was the only one i noticed on the first page, im sure there are plenty of topics you could show to your dad to help persuade cheers but i just wanted a real clear topic of people opinions. thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gage-mann Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 if you suffer from arm pump it can help but water bleeds have to be done more often as water compresses but it gives the lever a fast flicky feel with water being thinner its more re-active which gives it that fast flicky feel, at the moment am running oil but summers just about here and when i do some lines i get arm pump soo i may water bleed my brake again........... as for your dad say it gives you super powers on a bike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris4stars Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 (edited) not sure if the difference was as big for others, but id rather buy a new magura each year and keep a water bleed than go back to royal blood! not only has a more responsive brake no doubt saved my ass a number of times, the boost to my confidence and enjoyment in riding as a result is well worth it....along with the amount of people who havent had any problems with it in the first place, and the ability to quickly and easily get a perfect bleed, i cant see why id ever go back It can only rust in the presence of water and air. If the spring was rusted it's been badly bled or has been sitting for ages unused in a partly filled state. I've also been using pure (tap) water for about 7 years with no problems at all. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This I use RO water, no mineral deposits, totally neutral never had a problem either. Oil in a maggie sucks I've been using water bled maggies for 2 years now without a problem. I use tap water and anti-freeze/engine coolant. Haven't had any problems with seals yet, and the coolant has lube in it to keep all internal moving parts working well. I know George uses de-ironised water and anti-freeze to bleed his, might be worth a try if your really bothered about it I have absolutely no interest in explaining it. No matter how much you point how good waterbleeds and so on are, people seem to love making up things to suggest why they apparently don't work (in ways that normal, mineral oil bled Maguras often fail too). So yeah - if people don't want to run a water bleed then cool. If they do, then that's cool - it works well and has a significantly better lever feel. Oh, but it does rape your warranty. Just gotta add that in To each their own, I run water and I realise that if I remember to keep the seals lubed and serviced, it's gonna last long enough to justify spending a few quid on the lube, and saving a lot more on royal blood. If it bothers you that much, run royal blood and let us run water? It's all about the lever feel, it's lighter and more responsive. It's also free assuming you don't get magic rusty springs. Edited May 16, 2010 by chris4stars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modifiedridah2k9 Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 100% worth it! gives you a much nicer feel on the lever, I have had no problems at all! Much nicer than an oil or magura royal blood feels. DO IT! DO IT! DO IT! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINDUS Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 If the hs33 was made for water it would come standard!! keep it blood! no repeat bleeds needed unless you damage your hose. My hs33 have been running for about 4 years now trouble free I know im going to get a big face palm from all the other water bleed lovers for what i have just said, and im ready to take it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Dark Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 If the hs33 was made for water it would come standard!! keep it blood! no repeat bleeds needed unless you damage your hose. My hs33 have been running for about 4 years now trouble free I know im going to get a big face palm from all the other water bleed lovers for what i have just said, and im ready to take it And if the magura was designed to have a braided cross-over...washerless clamps...longer blades...cnc'd pads...ti hardware it'd come standard, oh...wait It's an improvement for us trials riders...we're adapting an XC commuter brake for the best possible performance in trials, ergo there have to be some differences in what we want from a brake. Light lever feel is hardly important for commuters or tandem riders is it? There are no real ill-effects from water bleeds...I must have owned around 10 maguras now? All water bled...all worked fine until one or two cracked / got cannibalised or got sold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINDUS Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 And if the magura was designed to have a braided cross-over...washerless clamps...longer blades...cnc'd pads...ti hardware it'd come standard, oh...wait It's an improvement for us trials riders...we're adapting an XC commuter brake for the best possible performance in trials, ergo there have to be some differences in what we want from a brake. Light lever feel is hardly important for commuters or tandem riders is it? There are no real ill-effects from water bleeds...I must have owned around 10 maguras now? All water bled...all worked fine until one or two cracked / got cannibalised or got sold. All the parts you mention are made to work with magura! and will not damage the brake, water will over time damage the insides of the brake. The new evo brake from magura is made with trials use in mind, better fittings like 4 bolt clamps yet they still bleed with blood. The germans know what they are doing, or they would sell the brake with a bottle of evion. water bleed = damage to brake internally , more time to bleed as it fades over time. not covered by magura warranty royal blood = made for the brake only needs bleeding if damage to the hose. if brake leaks full 5 year warranty. At the end of the day its down to each rider to make there minds up, I'm not fighting to say it does not work because it clearly does and so many people are happy, i just don't get the effort having to bleed the brake every 3 months and to make sure you don't forget the anti freeze in the winter i can get my bike from the garage sun, rain or freeze and know the brakes will work from the start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris4stars Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 All the parts you mention are made to work with magura! and will not damage the brake, water will over time damage the insides of the brake. The new evo brake from magura is made with trials use in mind, better fittings like 4 bolt clamps yet they still bleed with blood. The germans know what they are doing, or they would sell the brake with a bottle of evion. water bleed = damage to brake internally , more time to bleed as it fades over time. not covered by magura warranty royal blood = made for the brake only needs bleeding if damage to the hose. if brake leaks full 5 year warranty. At the end of the day its down to each rider to make there minds up, I'm not fighting to say it does not work because it clearly does and so many people are happy, i just don't get the effort having to bleed the brake every 3 months and to make sure you don't forget the anti freeze in the winter i can get my bike from the garage sun, rain or freeze and know the brakes will work from the start. even if in theory it does damage the brake over time (im not sure how long, theres lots of positive comments for 2-3years+) its worth it for those 2-3 years a water bleed literally takes no time at all, only 2/3 minutes on your own and you can have the full system flushed out and working again with a fresh bleed...even quicker if you have a helper for the difference in feel (i use the braided hose and used royal blood for a while before changing) its worth the money youd fork out if you did need to replace the brake every 2 years...as a result of having a lighter and easier to control brake, im sure i have avoided an injury of some sorts. i have more confidence in the brake, my riding is progressing faster as a result...its win win win etc in my opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 I am back using a maggie (booo hiss) and I could NEVER ride with standard oil. There is pretty much no bad points to water bleeds. You don't need to top them up after 3 months, it doesn't ruin the brake, it DOES make the brake feel a million times better though, it DOES reduce arm pump. It's a good job not everyone sticks to guidelines otherwise we would never see improvements unless companies did it themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skorp Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 (edited) my old style magura brake have been used with water for 6-7 years..Now a couple of days ago the piston got stuck..i lubed the piston with WD-40 and now its like new. Maguras are pretty much everlasting whatever you bleed them with! Edited May 16, 2010 by Skorp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cahill Trials Kid Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 I would defently do it ! ive just gone to water bleed and do much prefer it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skoze Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 bleed it with a cable! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINDUS Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 bleed it with a cable! Now thats a different topic!! oil or water bleed would beat a cable!!! anybody knows that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 my rear vees were always easierr to pull than a water bled maggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt.price Posted May 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 my rear vees were always easierr to pull than a water bled maggy may i ask why your on maggie now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 because when I am doing spins my leg pushes the vee arms onto the rim, never been a problem when riding normal trials though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old boy chez Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 All the parts you mention are made to work with magura! and will not damage the brake, water will over time damage the insides of the brake. The new evo brake from magura is made with trials use in mind, better fittings like 4 bolt clamps yet they still bleed with blood. The germans know what they are doing, or they would sell the brake with a bottle of evion. water bleed = damage to brake internally , more time to bleed as it fades over time. not covered by magura warranty royal blood = made for the brake only needs bleeding if damage to the hose. if brake leaks full 5 year warranty. At the end of the day its down to each rider to make there minds up, I'm not fighting to say it does not work because it clearly does and so many people are happy, i just don't get the effort having to bleed the brake every 3 months and to make sure you don't forget the anti freeze in the winter i can get my bike from the garage sun, rain or freeze and know the brakes will work from the start. agree 100% this was what i was getting at in another post . but instead i got take the p##s out of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 Maguras are still not "designed for trials" they are xc brakes that we use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt.price Posted May 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 Maguras are still not "designed for trials" they are xc brakes that we use. but they do the job and thats what matters... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Scarlet Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 I rode maguras with mineral oil in for a couple of years, went discs, gone back to rear magura with water bleed and the lever feel is tremendous. I used to suffer with minor arm pump/hand cramp but this is almost non existent with the water bleed, it also has a much quicker release/response, much like a cable lever. This was one of the things that annoyed me running mineral oil in my current set-up, as I have a front vee and rear magura which didn't return anywhere near as quick as the vee. Water bleed and all sorted. As for damaging your brakes and such, A) If it does it is really insignificant amounts, the magura I've got is a pre 05 style, with several owners all that I know off ran it on water and it is still going fine. Its really not the end of the world if it does, brakes are cheap as and the majority of us replace such parts after 5 years of useage. At the rate that my brake is "wearing away" at, I'd much rather have water in it, for it does sod all wrong to the system! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coyoteboy Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 I think the point is run what you like, but accept that running water will eventually cause problems with the brake (thats just the nature of water/alu interfaces), but if you accept that you're willing to trade off lifespan for what you consider an improved feel. I personally love the stock maggie feel, never suffer pump and can't see a reason for changing, but then I do have a strong grip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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