Observedtrials.net Hacked!

[Fish-Finger-er]

In the UK you really don't pay anything for healthcare, here you can be paying 4 figures a year. I know my wife is spending around $100 a year on pills, and there's been situations where my mother in law couldn't afford to buy her meds. So if a socialistic view on health care is going to prevent this i'm all for it.

erm yay and nay, paying $100 dollars a year for pills(assuming shes on permanent medication) really isnt that bad, in the 2 weeks following my crash I spent £30 on prescriptions, which is like $50. so over the course of a year, if she has to go and pick pills up more than 8 times in a year, it'd cost her that over here.

Also whats the tax on what you earn? I take home about 2/3 of what I earn after tax and NI etc, then get taxed again when I spend it. Id much rather pay for healhcare, than spend $1500 dollars a year on tax for the diesel I buy, after the goverment have already took well over $10,000 dollars off my wages.

also the amount of people going privately these days is quite high(I already have to for dental care atm, and am debating doing it for healthcare) in which case I may as well be paying for it.

Also in the uk, the rich looking after the poor doesnt work, its more the moderately rich funding the poor(often poor by choice) a lot of the people earning megabucks, dont pay that much tax (in relation to what they earn).

[JT!]

erm yay and nay, paying $100 dollars a year for pills(assuming shes on permanent medication) really isnt that bad, in the 2 weeks following my crash I spent £30 on prescriptions, which is like $50. so over the course of a year, if she has to go and pick pills up more than 8 times in a year, it'd cost her that over here.

Also whats the tax on what you earn? I take home about 2/3 of what I earn after tax and NI etc, then get taxed again when I spend it. Id much rather pay for healhcare, than spend $1500 dollars a year on tax for the diesel I buy, after the goverment have already took well over $10,000 dollars off my wages.

also the amount of people going privately these days is quite high(I already have to for dental care atm, and am debating doing it for healthcare) in which case I may as well be paying for it.

Also in the uk, the rich looking after the poor doesnt work, its more the moderately rich funding the poor(often poor by choice) a lot of the people earning megabucks, dont pay that much tax (in relation to what they earn).

$100 isn't bad, but what you've got to remember she is on a disabled medical program. If she was in the UK, she would get all her pills free because she is disabled and only able to work earning a part time wage.

I personally don't work, but taxes seem to be pretty similar, however if you work for a place that'll give you insurance, they'll take around $100 from your for every $800 you make. Or you can opt out of that and buy insurance yourself for stupid amounts of money.

I've seen all sides of private and public healthcare, the quality of healthcare here is better than at home, but here people who have no insurance and really screwed, being asked to pay $300 for a months worth of one type of pills is just crazy.

[indianatrials]

He's American, what do you expect?!

you were talking to an american so much hate lol I dont care if you think im a nut. maybe i am roflol.

Edited December 22, 2009 by indianatrials

[monkeyseemonkeydo]

so much hate lol

[JT!]

you were talking to an american so much hate lol

I'm not an American i'm just living here at the mo.

[indianatrials]

I'm not an American i'm just living here at the mo.

gotcha, lol

[monkeyseemonkeydo]

I'm not an American i'm just living here at the mo.

One of us! One of us! One of us!

[J Trials 31]

Well everyone pays taxes, the more you earn the more you pay. That is socialism, the rich looking after the poor. So really every country has socialistic elements.

In the UK you really don't pay anything for healthcare, here you can be paying 4 figures a year. I know my wife is spending around $100 a year on pills, and there's been situations where my mother in law couldn't afford to buy her meds. So if a socialistic view on health care is going to prevent this i'm all for it.

You're just a run of the mill conspiracy nut.

So you think your not paying for healthcare, where's the money for your "free" healthcare coming then? It's coming from your taxes. The government doesn't just conjure up money, it comes from you. Instead of one person paying for there own healthcare, you got everyone in the whole country paying yours. Good insurance companies no longer pay for your medical bills and the insurance company goes out of business putting countless people out of work. Just wonderful isn't it. Oh, and 70% of all americans live paycheck to paycheck so maybe that has something to do with your mother in law. You simply can't live off of social "in"security. You still have to save for retirement the old fashioned way. IRA's and 401K's. Not dissing your mother in law, most of my family is in the same boat.

[monkeyseemonkeydo]

the insurance company goes out of business putting countless people out of work. Just wonderful isn't it.

Yeah man, I always feel so sorry for the poor insurance companies... cheating wastes of space that they are.

The score with healthcare in the UK is that everone who works pays National Insurance (basically a tax). That then covers (in theory) the state old age pension and the whole 'National Health Service' which pays for alcoholics to get new livers, treats chain smokers for lung cancer and pays for the odd gender reallocation surgery among other things. Ok, selling it really short and that's unfair but it is a bit weird. So yes, we all pay for our health service in one way or another but when you need something done, no matter how costly, it'll be free on the NHS.

[J Trials 31]

Yeah man, I always feel so sorry for the poor insurance companies... cheating wastes of space that they are.

The score with healthcare in the UK is that everone who works pays National Insurance (basically a tax). That then covers (in theory) the state old age pension and the whole 'National Health Service' which pays for alcoholics to get new livers, treats chain smokers for lung cancer and pays for the odd gender reallocation surgery among other things. Ok, selling it really short and that's unfair but it is a bit weird. So yes, we all pay for our health service in one way or another but when you need something done, no matter how costly, it'll be free on the NHS.

Yeah, but what next, they got your health care they will go after something else next. What are they working on passing now? See most people wouldn't like it that they are paying for someone to get trans gender surgery or other stuff as you mentioned, and I'm sure there are a lot of people who can't even afford to pay there taxes let alone want to do that. By the way, if everyone gets stuff for free then what's the point in working? I know this is american history, but did you ever hear of what they tried at Jamestown and Plymouth? They tried sort of the same setup where people put all there stuff that they made ( corn, meat from animals they killed) in a big pile and when someone wanted something they went and got it. Sounds like a good idea, but people decided they didn't want to go out all day hunting for an animal and then bringing it for some guy sitting on his lazy rump to eat it all. So eventually they stopped working and many died from starvation and the odd Indian attacks ( they hadn't built up there defenses for the same reason). Then they gave everyone a plot of land and told everyone to grow their own corn and hunt there own food for their families. Just read any countries history who has had communism as a basis.

[JT!]

So you think your not paying for healthcare, where's the money for your "free" healthcare coming then? It's coming from your taxes. The government doesn't just conjure up money, it comes from you. Instead of one person paying for there own healthcare, you got everyone in the whole country paying yours.

Yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. The problem is in the USA there's some people who can't afford insurance or have been denied because of existing conditions. In the UK no one is denied because in the UK it isn't ran like a business.

Good insurance companies no longer pay for your medical bills and the insurance company goes out of business putting countless people out of work. Just wonderful isn't it.

Health insurance companies do employ a lot of people, but those people loosing their job in the grand scheme of things isn't an issue. It's like saying lets stop littering, oh no wait we can't because we're putting the people who pick it up out of work.

Oh, and 70% of all americans live paycheck to paycheck so maybe that has something to do with your mother in law. You simply can't live off of social "in"security. You still have to save for retirement the old fashioned way. IRA's and 401K's. Not dissing your mother in law, most of my family is in the same boat.

How has people living paycheck to paycheck got anything to do with my mother in law? I don't care if you diss her I don't agree how she lives her life in any way shape or form.

At the end of the say heath insurance companies make 30-40% profit, Medicare makes 1% profit. US citizens are essentially giving their money away to the insurance companies to pay for the whole thing to be ran when it isn't even necessary.

UK citizens pay around 300 pounds a year towards healthcare it's estimated.

[J Trials 31]

I am not supporting the insurance companies. They do take a lot of money that they don't actually need to do what they do, and it has been getting worse in recent years. Their policies don't cover everything and such.

Living paycheck to paycheck has a lot to do with it. If someone had money saved for retirement they could pay for their medicine and whatever else they needed to live on.

You maybe paying 300 pounds a year on it, but how much all together? That's not covering all of it, your countries going into huge debt because of it. Our country is so far in debt as it is we'll be run by China in a few years probably. lol

Yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. The problem is in the USA there's some people who can't afford insurance or have been denied because of existing conditions. In the UK no one is denied because in the UK it isn't ran like a business.

Health insurance companies do employ a lot of people, but those people loosing their job in the grand scheme of things isn't an issue. It's like saying lets stop littering, oh no wait we can't because we're putting the people who pick it up out of work.

How has people living paycheck to paycheck got anything to do with my mother in law? I don't care if you diss her I don't agree how she lives her life in any way shape or form.

At the end of the say heath insurance companies make 30-40% profit, Medicare makes 1% profit. US citizens are essentially giving their money away to the insurance companies to pay for the whole thing to be ran when it isn't even necessary.

UK citizens pay around 300 pounds a year towards healthcare it's estimated.

[JT!]

You maybe paying 300 pounds a year on it, but how much all together? That's not covering all of it, your countries going into huge debt because of it. Our country is so far in debt as it is we'll be run by China in a few years probably. lol

And America isn't?

[J Trials 31]

And America isn't?

Sure, it is. Socialism is here too. The New Deal pretty much started all of it here.

Let me ask you, you think everyone should live in welfare homes. Everyone should be equal. Nobody should be able to get ahead in life. That's what it will come to.

How about the quality of the surgeries and the doctors you have with the free healthcare? Not so great is it? That's why a lot of people come here, cause we don't have socialized medicine.

[JT!]

Sure, it is. Socialism is here too. The New Deal pretty much started all of it here.

Let me ask you, you think everyone should live in welfare homes. Everyone should be equal. Nobody should be able to get ahead in life. That's what it will come to.

How about the quality of the surgeries and the doctors you have with the free healthcare? Not so great is it? That's why a lot of people come here, cause we don't have socialized medicine.

Socialism is good in come cases. Pubic school is one of them. No one is bitching about how we all pay for schools which is free for everyone.

People can get a head in life, and i'm not saying we should all have the same car and the same house and the same clothes etc.

Surgery is better in this country, that's true, however what're you willing to sacrifice for that? Besides in the UK you can pay for private healthcare if you so choose.

[Jason222]

Our country is certainly not socialistic and communist yet, but it sure is going there fast. Socialism has been proven many times to not work, and idiots keep trying it. History is doomed to repeat itself. You Europeans don't realize what your doing to your own economy and well being. Wanting to be socialist is not a good thing. It may seem cool to not have to work, but when you have no food and all your money goes to the government your going no where fast. If everybody works for the things they have it creates competition for businesses hence capitalism. I agree with indianatrials here, but a few of the things he's said are not quite accurate. I hope you guys in Britain realize you don't want your country to go that way. Do you really want more taxes and such? That's basically what the start of socialism is and it has been going on forever in both of our countries. Do taxes ever get smaller? NO.

Spoken like a true American.

But my god, you have no idea what you're talking about. America is on the far end of the spectrum! America is one of the most capitalistic countries in the world! History is not doomed to repeat itself - that's why it's called history. If one doesn't document what has happened in the past - then yes, history could possibly repeat itself. The goal of recording what humanity has done in the past is so that we can better ourselves from this experience.

Socialism is not 'cool because you don't have to work'. You still have to work. But why should someone who has no job be rejected for health care? This doesn't just apply to the bum that sits on the corner asking for change. This applies for anyone that's out of work. Socialism just relocates wealth. In a capitalistic society you see that the majority of wealth is held by a small group of people, leaving a large group of people in poverty. The goal of socialist ideas is to try to distribute wealth more evenly.

One thing I don't understand here, you say that Europeans with their socialist ideas are doing the wrong thing, yet your capitalist country is so much better isn't it? The US is in the shitter right now because it's overly capitalist. The US's governmental structure is falling apart at the seams - people are without work, loosing their jobs, and without healthcare or are paying ridiculous amounts of money for health care. The difference in the amount of tax you pay vs the payments you make for your own health care plan are huge.

Canada has a mixture of capitalist and socialist ways. While the US has had a recession over the last few years, Canada hasn't. The only thing we've noticed are slightly increased gas prices.

Many developed countries are flowing into a mixture of capitalism and socialism. I think it's the only possible way for the evolution of our society.

[durkie]

They do take a lot of money that they don't actually need to do what they do, and it has been getting worse in recent years.

something lovely about hearing this from someone so worried about the US becoming more communist or socialist.

yall are a bunch of weirdos. vote for thread relock.

[Jason222]

vote for thread relock.

Edited December 22, 2009 by Jason222

[J Trials 31]

Spoken like a true American.

But my god, you have no idea what you're talking about. America is on the far end of the spectrum! America is one of the most capitalistic countries in the world! History is not doomed to repeat itself - that's why it's called history. If one doesn't document what has happened in the past - then yes, history could possibly repeat itself. The goal of recording what humanity has done in the past is so that we can better ourselves from this experience.

Socialism is not 'cool because you don't have to work'. You still have to work. But why should someone who has no job be rejected for health care? This doesn't just apply to the bum that sits on the corner asking for change. This applies for anyone that's out of work. Socialism just relocates wealth. In a capitalistic society you see that the majority of wealth is held by a small group of people, leaving a large group of people in poverty. The goal of socialist ideas is to try to distribute wealth more evenly.

One thing I don't understand here, you say that Europeans with their socialist ideas are doing the wrong thing, yet your capitalist country is so much better isn't it? The US is in the shitter right now because it's overly capitalist. The US's governmental structure is falling apart at the seams - people are without work, loosing their jobs, and without healthcare or are paying ridiculous amounts of money for health care. The difference in the amount of tax you pay vs the payments you make for your own health care plan are huge.

Canada has a mixture of capitalist and socialist ways. While the US has had a recession over the last few years, Canada hasn't. The only thing we've noticed are slightly increased gas prices.

Many developed countries are flowing into a mixture of capitalism and socialism. I think it's the only possible way for the evolution of our society.

Think about what your saying. Your saying you should take money from people who work for it, ( rich people) and give it to people who generally don't work for it ( poor people). Can't believe you think that's right. Taking money from someone who works hard for it is wrong. And I'm not a rich person either. Our country has a lot of socialist things in it right now that are destroying the economy, it's not capitalism destroying it. Capitalism promotes hard work and free trade. One person makes a product then someone comes out with a competitor product with a lower price, then the other lowers it's price and so on. This is how it works.

[Jason222]

Think about what your saying. Your saying you should take money from people who work for it, ( rich people) and give it to people who generally don't work for it ( poor people). Can't believe you think that's right. Taking money from someone who works hard for it is wrong. And I'm not a rich person either. Our country has a lot of socialist things in it right now that are destroying the economy, it's not capitalism destroying it. Capitalism promotes hard work and free trade. One person makes a product then someone comes out with a competitor product with a lower price, then the other lowers it's price and so on. This is how it works.

No.

Rich people often do very little work for the amount of money they are paid. I believe it's fair that the doctor that gets paid 500,000 a year should be taxed to benefit his underlings that do all the physical work for him, and get paid some measly unfair wage.

My point was that work is not always equated with the amount of money one will make. A grade school teacher works hard for their 35,000 a year pay, while CEO's of Americas corporations get paid millions to sit in a chair and tell people what to do. The school teacher probably does much more work, but are not rewarded in the same accordance as the CEO.

Your ideas of economics are extremely flawed. You don't understand how economics work.

Please name a socialist thing that is bringing your country down.

Edited December 22, 2009 by Jason222

[Rush]

Lets dispense with the political dicussion and get back to good old BLACK COCK.

Anyway, OTN will be down for a good while I think.

Hey Tomturd, can we has an "OTN refugees" thread/section?

ps. These emoticons are strange and terrifying.

Edited December 22, 2009 by Rush

[JT!]

Think about what your saying. Your saying you should take money from people who work for it, ( rich people) and give it to people who generally don't work for it ( poor people).

That's pretty much how it is though. The amount of tax you pay depends on how much you earn. It's like that in all developed countries.

It's true it isn't a perfect system, but it's giving money to the disabled, the old and generally people who can't look after them selves.

There's nothing wrong with that is there?

[N.Wood]

Lets dispense with the political dicussion and get back to good old BLACK COCK.

Anyway, OTN will be down for a good while I think.

Hey Tomturd, can we has an "OTN refugees" thread/section?

ps. These emoticons are strange and terrifying.

Rush, what happned to that non-pulse forum that arose after OTN was down for a while last time?

[Rush]

That was Darrell's (trauma) site.

Pretty sure its not still running though.

[J Trials 31]

That's pretty much how it is though. The amount of tax you pay depends on how much you earn. It's like that in all developed countries.

It's true it isn't a perfect system, but it's giving money to the disabled, the old and generally people who can't look after them selves.

There's nothing wrong with that is there?

Yes, it's supposed to go to those people isn't it, but it rarely does. The government has all that money sitting there burning a hole in their pocket and they go spend it on roads and other things and by the time the older or disabled people get there money, it's not enough to live on.

How do the people get in the places where they get paid tons of money to do nothing. Look at their history you'll see that they have done plenty of hard work and made many sacrifices to get where they are. The people in CEO's didn't just get given that job, they have worked their whole life for that position. Your right, teachers should get paid more, but they are paid by the government once again who has to conjure up money out of nowhere.