Car Geeks Ahoy!

[Ducko]

hi guys,

ive had a bit of an issue with the car when its not upto temprature, (the cars a mitsubishi cyborg - bit like a colt, 1.6 dohc injection)

ill be driving the car and it'll be going perfectly find, then ill put my footdown and it feel's really under powered and stuttery but then a few seconds later it'll be fine and when the car's warms its fine,

the rev's still build up but the car doesnt seem too move...?

ive tried eliminating different things too solve it but had no luck:

changed coilpacks,

changed spark plugs

changed my air filter (one i had was direct air feed thought the water being sucked through might be too much)

no luck,

does anyone have any advice at all? or any ideas on what the problem could be? is there any sensors i should clean?

i always run good fluids in the car, v power is always used.

could it be the leads of the coils? one of them seems too have a slight brown tint too the stalk?

fuel filter? fuel pressure?

any ideas/ advice appreciated

cheers guys

craig

Edited November 18, 2009 by craigduckuk@hotmail.com

[Little Yoshi]

Might be dirt in the carb?

[Ducko]

throttle body is clean as a whistle.

[Jolfa]

Well an idea what car it is would be a good start...

It's either a fuel delivery problem or a spark problem...

[Ducko]

its a mitsi cyborg (bit like a colt but has a mivec 1.6 engine)

[Will Arnold]

just a thought fella, change your temperature sensors - should be cheap to do. it might be under fuelling when cold if they're faulty.

[Ducko]

you mean like the lamda sensor or the one in the inlet manifold?

cheers

[trialsmax04]

I have to say it does sound like the lamda. It controls the mixture so if its on its way out then it will not be running a mixture rich enough for the engine whilst cold.

[Matthew_Gibson]

Quick search shows that a Lamda sensor are about £30 off ebay.

Could be MAF thinking there too much or tolittle air. Get yor slef up to the sprappy and see if you can get some bits colt. there probably the same.

[Ducko]

this car uses a MAP sensor which is a bit of a pain dont know much about them,

ill see if i can get a new lamda it might help..

the problems started one day after driving for about 4 hours in really heavy rain...

[Tomm]

This problem sounds exactly like my car!

For me, it only happens when it's raining. My car has been 100% reliable in the dry, but when it's very wet outside I can almost guarantee this problem will happen within about 0.5 miles of my drive. I put my foot down, and the car splutters, the revs drop and sometimes they'll drop off so far it'll stall. When it stalls, it won't start again for at least 5-10 minutes, at which point it seems to start reluctantly and splutter some more for a while, taking another 10 mins or so to get up to being 'normal' again, and then it'll have no problems for the rest of the journey.

I've taken the car to a garage, and they couldn't find the source of the problem. There is actual money involved if someone on here can get to the bottom of this!

A couple of things: When my car died the other day (same reason) the RAC man turned up and had a play. He reckoned it was still sparking OK. When he opened the cylinder he was expecting that we'd flooded the engine (by trying to start it lots) but the cylinders were apparently dry. All this makes me think it's a problem with the fuel pump?! Perhaps the electrics of the fuel pump (because of the association with water) But I'm no mechanic, and I'm sure it could be lots of other things?

Car is a VW Polo 6n 1998 R reg 1.6l petrol 75 BHP engine manual.

P.S. Sorry if this is a semi-thread hijack.

[Simpson]

Do cars have automatic chokes? I'm a motorbike man lol

[Revolver]

Do cars have automatic chokes? I'm a motorbike man lol

Yep

[Simpson]

Yep

Nothing to do with that then?

[davey1991]

Jesus christ i might have the solution to this

My uncles shogun used to do the same thing, drive for ten minutes, splutter, cut out and then no issues.

It was something to do with his fuel filter he by passed it pretty illegally with a piece of hose and hasn't had the problen since.

I'm not sure on the details but thats what caused his.

[JD™]

How odd that my car started doing exactly this last night... Cut out 4 times on my way to and from the gym. Going to check the fuel pump and filter tonight I reckon...

[Ducko]

This problem sounds exactly like my car!

For me, it only happens when it's raining. My car has been 100% reliable in the dry, but when it's very wet outside I can almost guarantee this problem will happen within about 0.5 miles of my drive. I put my foot down, and the car splutters, the revs drop and sometimes they'll drop off so far it'll stall. When it stalls, it won't start again for at least 5-10 minutes, at which point it seems to start reluctantly and splutter some more for a while, taking another 10 mins or so to get up to being 'normal' again, and then it'll have no problems for the rest of the journey.

I've taken the car to a garage, and they couldn't find the source of the problem. There is actual money involved if someone on here can get to the bottom of this!

A couple of things: When my car died the other day (same reason) the RAC man turned up and had a play. He reckoned it was still sparking OK. When he opened the cylinder he was expecting that we'd flooded the engine (by trying to start it lots) but the cylinders were apparently dry. All this makes me think it's a problem with the fuel pump?! Perhaps the electrics of the fuel pump (because of the association with water) But I'm no mechanic, and I'm sure it could be lots of other things?

Car is a VW Polo 6n 1998 R reg 1.6l petrol 75 BHP engine manual.

P.S. Sorry if this is a semi-thread hijack.

possibly worth changing your fuel relaey switch sometimes the damp can make them fault.

[Ben Swales]

For me, it only happens when it's raining. My car has been 100% reliable in the dry, but when it's very wet outside I can almost guarantee this problem will happen within about 0.5 miles of my drive. I put my foot down, and the car splutters, the revs drop and sometimes they'll drop off so far it'll stall. When it stalls, it won't start again for at least 5-10 minutes, at which point it seems to start reluctantly and splutter some more for a while, taking another 10 mins or so to get up to being 'normal' again, and then it'll have no problems for the rest of the journey.

This could be WAY off the mark, but my first car, a 1986 Nissan Micra Colette (which, incidentally, I bought at the start of the summer when I first passed my test, expecting it to just last me the summer and was still going 2+ years later!), used to do something similar to this, again, only when it was raining. I didn't know a lot about cars, still don't, but figured since it was rain-related, it had to be something to do with stuff getting wet/damp. I sprayed my plugs and cables with WD40 (at my dad's suggestion) every time it happened, and hey presto - sorted! At least until the next time.

So like I said, could be WAY off the mark, but have you checked whether your plugs/cables etc. are damp when it happens?

[basher]

to all you guys saying your having problems in rain, sounds like its rain getting to ignition, and they will start 10min later as the ignition has dried out enough. if they run off dizzys and a coil try covering it with a plastic bag or some form of guard or just sealing things as best as possible. also spraying wd40 on everything helps. if they dont run off a dizzy then cover as much of the ignition wiring, ecu ect as possible with something. i guarrentie you your problem will go away.

ps: make sure the plastic bag isn't near manifold or anything hot.

[Tomm]

possibly worth changing your fuel relaey switch sometimes the damp can make them fault.

Is that easy to do? What do fuel relay switches do?

This could be WAY off the mark, but my first car, a 1986 Nissan Micra Colette (which, incidentally, I bought at the start of the summer when I first passed my test, expecting it to just last me the summer and was still going 2+ years later!), used to do something similar to this, again, only when it was raining. I didn't know a lot about cars, still don't, but figured since it was rain-related, it had to be something to do with stuff getting wet/damp. I sprayed my plugs and cables with WD40 (at my dad's suggestion) every time it happened, and hey presto - sorted! At least until the next time.

So like I said, could be WAY off the mark, but have you checked whether your plugs/cables etc. are damp when it happens?

to all you guys saying your having problems in rain, sounds like its rain getting to ignition, and they will start 10min later as the ignition has dried out enough. if they run off dizzys and a coil try covering it with a plastic bag or some form of guard or just sealing things as best as possible. also spraying wd40 on everything helps. if they dont run off a dizzy then cover as much of the ignition wiring, ecu ect as possible with something. i guarrentie you your problem will go away.

Yeah for a long time I thought it was the distributor / leads, and I've tried spraying the leads with WD40 and it didn't help. Also the RAC man apparently checked the leads and they were all sparking which makes me think it's something else?

[basher]

well just stick a plastic bag over your dizzy and coil and see if it stops the problem. thats best way to rule it out.

[Fish-Finger-er]

Fuel relay just provides power to the fuel pump. Pass on location. however,rather than changing it, next time it happens just bridge it out with a bit of wire (will be a 4 pin relay, 1 pin is vehicle earth, 1 is a switched live, another is a permanent live, another a switched live, and an output, there will possibly be a diagram on the relay with pin numbers on it, which relate to the pins underneath (should be stamped in the plastic next to the pins) want to bridge the permanent live and the output out. if it still dont start youve eliminated your problem (and unless its under the bonnet I cant see it effecting it too much)

Should be able to see if theres fuel pressure there, should just be able to crack off a nut on the fuel rail(wear goggles/look away, its not a dangerous pressure but you dont want it in your eye) and see whether fuel squirts out or not with the ignition off. turn it on, and if the car is still not starting properly, crack the nut off again(can leave the ignition on) if fuel is getting through. if you take off the air filter housing(big black plastic arranement on top of the engine), exposing the throttle body (give that a clean whilst your there) the fuel rail will be just behind the throttle body from memory.

Other things it could be, which I dont really expect you to be able to/want to check.

crankshaft sensor (its on the outside of the gearbox, so its vulnerable to water), basically tells your engine which position its in (on the 4 stroke cycle, not where it is in the car), if waters splashing up from the road, getting that wet, it could effect it, keep it standing for 10 minutes, it gets dry enough to start again, but takes a few minutes for the engine bay to get hot enough to dry it out. (thats clutching at straws)

lambda sensor, relates to the fuel/air mix going into the engine, its on the exhaust, so is again vulnerable, water splashes up yadda yadda, It think its running to rich, reduces fuel delivery through the injectors(although one would think that it would still start with some pressing of the fast pedal) car is too lean to start, dries out, then within 10 minutes of starting, the exhaust gets that hot, it boils water on contact, so runs fine the rest of the journey.

Idle contol valve is always my diagnosis with VW's that cut out/idle improperly/splutter/hesitate, (mainly because ive looked at 3 cars with that issue, and each time its been that, and I told my mate to check his, and it was with his as well). Dont see why its doing it in the wet only, or why its stopping after a few minutes, can understand it only doing it when the engines cold, but not just in the wet.

Edited November 19, 2009 by Fish-Finger-er

[DrDoom]

http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[downhill_rob2@hotmail.com]

I havent got a clue what would be up with your car guys, but i have got a pretty shitty problem...

The other night (thursday) i was driving to my mates house, and as it started to rain, i just flicked my wipers on, then it made a little sound (asif i fuse had gone) and then my immobiliser light flashed on and off about 5 times, then went off, then my engine management light came on, and my speedo went to 0, and my lights started pulsing bright then dim i pulled up outside my mates house, knocked it off, and then it wouldnt start again! its cranking over, but it doesnt seam to be letting fuel into the engine (its still sparking, we´ve checked that)

The immobiliser light doesnt come on anymore, when i turn the ignition on. we´ve checked all the fuses etc, to see what it was, and we cant find what it could be i even left the battery disconnected since thursday night, to try and reset the immobiliser, but still.. nothing

My car is a: Honda Civic EK4 1998 3door Hatchback

Any ideas anybody?

Edited November 21, 2009 by downhill_rob2@hotmail.com

[PaRtZ]

well just stick a plastic bag over your dizzy and coil and see if it stops the problem. thats best way to rule it out.

That issue, youre right in solution and cause, but its only if the car fails to start at all. Craig said that it starts but when he puts his foot down it gives up a bit

Craig do the fuel filter I reckon. Mines always done it (being manual choke) I think the lambda sensor is also a good idea, your ECU may be starving your initial combustion of fuel*. Sorry, uni's taking over lol...

Do fuel filter as its cheapish, then lambda, then get back to us

*Going on the idea of, the petrol is colder, so its more dense. Meaning, your sensor cant differentiate between cold and warm petrol, so when it senses the denser petrol, it thinks theres just more of it, and increases air intake, hence making it lean burn.