Will Arnold Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 Couple of points. First of all,anyone follow what the coin toss rules where? was it they took it in turns to flip the coin, and both peoples flips counted,because if that was the case, unless they flipped 30 heads in a row, the women was always going to win (as in the man who picked HHH, and the woman picked THH, well as soon as HH had been flipped, then THH would of been flipped, unless the first flip to each count was a head, meaning the man only ever had a 1 in 8 chance for each round, whereas the women had a chance of 7/8. (because they flipped till they got the combination and started again, unless 3 heads where flipped off the bat, then THH would always win that round before HHH)Obviously if the rules where that only your flip counted towards your combination, it was the deeper maths bit, I havent and most likely wont read in to.Also, note he never discounts any theory he announces apart from sleight of hand and faking a lottery ticket, yet mentioned the one he wants you to believe,along with a split screen, lasers cutting into the balls,and the fixing the machine. Meaning it could be any one of them 4,with him hoping you believe the main theory,discount the last one as impossible,and forget he mentioned the other 2. Along with telling you he "was going to tell you how to do it" As for stand on the knife, wouldnt take £500,000 for me to do that.kinda missed the point there? he did that to add some reality to the situation, to instill more fear.I'd do it for £500,000, but I'd be clever and make some insoles for my shoes out of a sheet of steel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomm Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 He didn't actually predict anything - as that suggests that he came up with the numbers before the lottery. Which he didn't. If he had done that, he could have done it days in advance, and he could have published the numbers in the paper or something. The only trick in all of that was how he got the ping-pong balls to say the same numbers that were revealed 10-20 seconds earlier. I don't know how he did that but I've seen far better magic tricks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 If he had done that, he could have done it days in advance, and he could have published the numbers in the paper or something.I can think of one slight drawback if he was to do that... Not a drawback for the Lottery of course but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muel Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 I reckon it was just a split camera jobby, the left hand side of the screen was on a loop so someone could put the right balls in place without being seen. The camera was bobbing around though, but looking at it I reckon the bobbing was done by a program of some sort, looks like the bobbing might be on a loop aswell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 I reckon it was just a split camera jobby, the left hand side of the screen was on a loop so someone could put the right balls in place without being seen. The camera was bobbing around though, but looking at it I reckon the bobbing was done by a program of some sort, looks like the bobbing might be on a loop aswell.I'm fairly sure it wasn't that. Anyone could've done that. Derren Brown's stuff is usually based on some form of misdirection or illusion, so I don't see why he'd effectively lower himself to just using a cheap editing trick? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Arnold Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 I'm fairly sure it wasn't that. Anyone could've done that. Derren Brown's stuff is usually based on some form of misdirection or illusion, so I don't see why he'd effectively lower himself to just using a cheap editing trick?then again, people might be looking at other areas rather than him using a cheap editing trick.can't wait for his next show, although most of the british population are stuck to their sofa's already Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukasMcNeal Posted September 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 (edited) Look at right hand!!!! Edited September 12, 2009 by LukasMcNeal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomm Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 OH EM GEE A THUMB! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 Or Lady Gaga's dick taking time out of poking out of her skirt at Glastonbury to poke out behind Derren Brown's bit of card in his show? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Has anyone seen my shoe? Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 I really dont understand what everyone is going on about with his thumb. Its not abnormal at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaRtZ Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 I really dont understand what everyone is going on about with his thumb. Its not abnormal at all?yeah same here, I cant see how it could help predict the lottery at all unless.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hdmackay Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 Look at right hand!!!!Left hand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D A N N Y Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 (edited) Youtube Video -> ">" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> Edited September 12, 2009 by D A N N Y Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManxTrialSpaz Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 yeah same here, I cant see how it could help predict the lottery at all unless.... Wait a second......These are fake hands! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Scarlet Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 (edited) I'd obviously stopped paying attention at that point because what they're doing isn't even automatic writing... they're just writing 6 numbers down with their eyes closed.No as explained in the show it is the Ideomotor effect, where a subject's subconscious mind makes a physical motions, in the case of Derrens work this very subtle motions made.Mentalists, Psychics, Swammi's and other performing artists have used the Ideomotor effect for centuries, best example I can give is the classic pendulum swing, the subject would hold a pendulum and subconciously wills it to move, and can then cast it into different directions, just by thought processes alone. While the subject only has subconcious thoughts of it moving, the Ideomotor effect gives the subject a subtle physical motion to make it swing.This all ties back in with suggestion and will-power, depending on how suggestive the artist is (in this case we are talking Derren Brown so incredibly good) and how suggestible the subject is the possibilities become endless. In fact there is a whole book covering different effects that can be used with the Ideomotor movement, Muscle reading, and other techniques used by famous mentalists. Psychophysiological Thought Reading by Banachek.EDIT: Oh the Ouija board is another example of the Ideomotor movement. Edited September 12, 2009 by Captain Scarlet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 No as explained in the show it is the Ideomotor effect, where a subject's subconscious mind makes a physical motions, in the case of Derrens work this very subtle motions made.Mentalists, Psychics, Swammi's and other performing artists have used the Ideomotor effect for centuries, best example I can give is the classic pendulum swing, the subject would hold a pendulum and subconciously wills it to move, and can then cast it into different directions, just by thought processes alone. While the subject only has subconcious thoughts of it moving, the Ideomotor effect gives the subject a subtle physical motion to make it swing.This all ties back in with suggestion and will-power, depending on how suggestive the artist is (in this case we are talking Derren Brown so incredibly good) and how suggestible the subject is the possibilities become endless. In fact there is a whole book covering different effects that can be used with the Ideomotor movement, Muscle reading, and other techniques used by famous mentalists. Psychophysiological Thought Reading by Banachek.EDIT: Oh the Ouija board is another example of the Ideomotor movement.But to be fair that's all bollocks though isn't it? The pendulum thing you describe is just the way the human works. If you 'will' the pendulum to move your brain will tell your hand to make the movements necessary. However, when the subjects are told to write numbers on a bit of paper in front of them, they're going to write numbers on the paper in front of them, decided by their brain. There's nothing mystic or Ideomotor to it. So are you saying that Derren influenced the 'subjects' to make sure they wrote down the right numbers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Scarlet Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 No Derren didn't influence them to right any specific number down, he just simply asked them to let themselves go, their instincts be instincts.You could see in the clip that a couple of the subjects had the right idea, by essentially letting their hand be dragged subconciously with the pen, creating a scribble which they would then convert to a number. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 No Derren didn't influence them to right any specific number down, he just simply asked them to let themselves go, their instincts be instincts.You could see in the clip that a couple of the subjects had the right idea, by essentially letting their hand be dragged subconciously with the pen, creating a scribble which they would then convert to a number.Mmm. I stand by the 'bollocks' label . By the simple fact that the people knew they were there as human number generators the automatic writing thing can't work. Anyway, this is meaningless because those people had nothing to do with the 'prediction' and were probably actors anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
club_card Posted September 14, 2009 Report Share Posted September 14, 2009 Derren brown rules, he does loads of amazing stuff!The best one is when he goes into a jewelry (can´t spell) shop and buys a ring with plain paper, that sort of stuff is posible although there are a few things he does that i think are going to far and just cant be possible.paying with paper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusevelt Posted September 14, 2009 Report Share Posted September 14, 2009 Can't wait till friday when he attempts to control the nation, that should be interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Can't wait till friday when he attempts to control the nation, that should be interesting.If i was him i'd just burst out laughing at the end of the show and say "imagine how many people actually just jumped out of their chairs" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam-Griffin Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 This Friday at 9pm on Channel 4, Derren Brown is supposedly performing a mind control exercise that will keep the nation glued to their seats for the duration of the programme.Just for a laugh, I'm going to put my chip pan on at about 8:59 and then leave it for an hour.Derren, if you're reading this, you better have some bloody good lawyers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitbat Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 No Derren didn't influence them to right any specific number down, he just simply asked them to let themselves go, their instincts be instincts.You could see in the clip that a couple of the subjects had the right idea, by essentially letting their hand be dragged subconciously with the pen, creating a scribble which they would then convert to a number.But the thing a lot of people are missing is he did the calculations for the final set of numbers, not the team he had working with him. There is nothing to say that there were no calculations involved with the final numbers as he did some alternative trickery to display the numbers he wanted.Chances are all the attempts to get the numbers leading up to the big day were just to add a bit of realism to the situation. He probably had a number of different teams doing the same thing in different rooms, and he used the team that produced the nearest set of numbers to put into the show, just to make it more 'real'.It was like something he did a long time ago where he guaranteed someone would win 7 out of 7 horse racing bets in a row, but when it came down to it he was actually doing the same thing with hundreds of people, and everyone all bet on a different horse, there would always be losers but one person would win all bets (as all bets were covered) and that was the person he used for the TV Show. He basically filtered it down from hundreds down to 1 person.What he does is very clever, some of it is so simple its clever but as a person he is very clever indeed.I dont think we will ever know how he truely did the lottery, but the split screen thing is the most beleivable scenario at the moment.I am hoping (in True Derren Brown Style), that all the 4 events are leading up to 1 big finale. On his shows he always seems to end on a big finale which has been set into motion since the beggining of the show.I love what he does, and his book is a really good read.Can't wait to see the next shows.PS. Watch the advert he did promoting the events, loads of hidden messages in there (on the bus, on the bilboard, numbers on the lamppost ..etc..)Frooty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JT! Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 But the thing a lot of people are missing is he did the calculations for the final set of numbers, not the team he had working with him. There is nothing to say that there were no calculations involved with the final numbers as he did some alternative trickery to display the numbers he wanted.Chances are all the attempts to get the numbers leading up to the big day were just to add a bit of realism to the situation. He probably had a number of different teams doing the same thing in different rooms, and he used the team that produced the nearest set of numbers to put into the show, just to make it more 'real'.He wouldn't have needed to do any of that because all that crap was just for show. The people never got to see any of the numbers anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannah Shucksmith Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Anyone else watching his mind control one tonight? Should be interesting... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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