Scott Gibbs Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 It doesn't look that bad actually, it just looks a bit low really, that seat might as well not be there. It would have been better if it had kept a bit more of a "diamond" style frame design.The reasons why it didnt sell were possibly due to:bland colour schemelow framehorrible looking dropout/disk mount designlack of marketing in the UKthere wasnt a decent rider on one to show what was possible on itHowever, the geometry does look ok, anyone know what the wheelbase was? Wonder if Adam@Tarty ever considered ordering any...Would anyone be interested in a similar frame if a manufacturer designed a decent, competetitvely priced one?-Andyyeah if it looked good, and was well made and not just based on the current crop of long, low and silver but just with a seat tube and saddle. Has to be designed from the ground up nice 'street' geo lovely and short and flicky, give it some nice features on it, style it sleek and mean, just like the latest street hardtails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Rainbird Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 just realised, that bike has no rear brake, the hose guides are not in use, and the fourbolt mounts appear to not line up by a mile, and thats definitely a 26" wheel! Build quality!!That'll be because it's a shit photoshop. Note the component graphics, side the drivetrain is etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEON Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Someone copy a zebdi please....every last detail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam-Griffin Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Toms Czar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam w Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 I know you said that you don't really want a steel frame, but just thought i'd add that Curtis were happy to make me a frame with a longer toptube/wheelbase than the stated options - (it only went up to 23", but i wanted 23.5" which should give a wheelbase of around 1065).Also you can raise or lower the headtube to give slightly different bb heights without affecting the head angle too much - (which is pretty spot on at 72*).You can also choose different gauge tubing depending on how light you want it. Basically my point is they are a lot more customisable than the website suggests. (I'm just building mine up now so will put pics up when it's done). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat Smith!! Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Lmao at that photoshopping . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross McArthur Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 I would love to see a 26" with a mk1 Ashton geo with the looks of an inspired and the finish of an Aorta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambo Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 I would love to see a 26" with a mk1 Ashton geo with the looks of an inspired and the finish of an Aorta.you dream much son that would be the perfect bike+1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted June 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 it would need a +25-30mm bb rise, as this would give you the flexibility to have it how you like. All you would need to do is play around with the bar/stem set up. So yeah, basically just a Fourplay with bigger wheels! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan81 Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 I have a Czar Freetrials, just need a small seat and they're great. There's hardly any decent pics of them and no vids of any decent riding on them though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeperson45 Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 I have a Czar Freetrials, just need a small seat and they're great. There's hardly any decent pics of them and no vids of any decent riding on them thoughDo you have any pics? They look swankin!I like my Koxx Levelboss personally, som esay they'reugly though. 1065 wheelbase ummm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted June 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 They just look too low. ...oh, and they're made by Deng Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IFallOffLots Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Tom's Czar looks awesome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.Wood Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 They just look too low. ...oh, and they're made by DengWhats wrong with Deng? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash-Kennard Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 They just look too low. ...oh, and they're made by Dengdeng is strong! and often looks great... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manuel Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 it would need a +25-30mm bb rise, as this would give you the flexibility to have it how you like. All you would need to do is play around with the bar/stem set up. So yeah, basically just a Fourplay with bigger wheels!I take it you have seen the old TRA videos of him riding the first pure ? +30 is waaay too high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted June 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Yes, but not for absolutely ages, what's your point? The 24" frames all have around that, I dont really see why its such a big issue? You need to retain some rear wheel stability, so it can be used for static moves as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simpson Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 what was attually rong with the czar freetrials ?They made an awful trials frame, with a saddle that it was impossible to slam / look presentableYes, but not for absolutely ages, what's your point? The 24" frames all have around that, I dont really see why its such a big issue? You need to retain some rear wheel stability, so it can be used for static moves as well.No not at all, since moving from my trials I'm doing a lot more manifesto, rolling, roll up to gap stuff rather than hop, hop, hop, hop, hop which looks shit, rolling moves look and feel so much more fluid. And if you don't like that don't get a street orientated frame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skoze Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Yes, but not for absolutely ages, what's your point? The 24" frames all have around that, I dont really see why its such a big issue? You need to retain some rear wheel stability, so it can be used for static moves as well.That's to compensate for the smaller wheelsize though, isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.Wood Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Yeah pretty sure thats just a function of the small wheel size, a +30 on a 24" isn't the same as a +30 on a 26"....Whats wrong with Deng stuff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted June 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 (edited) There are too many Deng brands, he doesn't just concentrate on one brand, instead everything seems under developed and very plain looking. There isn't much innovation.I hear what you're saying about the BB ride on a 26", but i think its still necessary for some rolling moves such as gaps. Maybe +30 is a bit too extreme, +15-20 might be a better compromise. If i was to buy one, it would have to be around this value. I agree that the point of a street frame is to make trials more fluid and less hoppy, but I dont see why we need to go back 7 or 8 years in terms of geometry.I dont want this topic to turn into some sort of geometry argument, as you can never satisfy everone. I just want to make the point that there is a gap in the market, and I myself would like to see (and ride) a street orientated 26" trials specific frame. And it MUST have a seat EDIT: I would also like to know the reason for a higher bb having more "affect" on 26". Edited June 10, 2009 by walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manuel Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 I think the question of geometry is the crux of this thread. As soon as geometry evolved toward the higher bb frames and longer wheelbases (and more hoppy) there was no real point to the seat - it just got in the way of the inch pinching. If you make a frame that is 1080 +30 say - how are you going to ride it ? I guarantee that you wont be spinning down stair sets and for most people, wont even be doing a bunnyhop. It will be trials on street, with lots of inch pinching and a seat is only goin to get in the way unless you make it stupidly low ala the czar etc ...To make a frame with a seat you need make it not matter that it is in the way for inch pinching, and hence not have it happen. And the only way to do that is to make it good at actual street. Then you can have it at a height that you can actually sit on with both feet on the pedals. Even my beloved echo pure 04 is pushing it in this respect as it is very good for actual trials, and a little less good for proper street. I think yes it may look good by why bother for a longer frame where it is JUST going to be in the way.Ive ranted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash-Kennard Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 (edited) 1050, 72, 380, +20 nice clean lines, with the downtube bottom flat, then into a rounded point near the top (_) stylee, a bolt hole to go through the frame into the seat post to keep it in place, vee mounts under the seatstays AND on top, so you can choose. built in booster, no disc mounts, nice, simple colour scheme, such as matt black with white stickers, or brown frame and black stickers (STICKERS, NOT ETCHED ONZA! SO WE CAN TAKE YOUR SHITTY GRAPHICS OFF),vertical dropouts. wide enough for a 2.4" tyre110 headtube1.8kg300 quid maxEDIT: made using a std size fork, not koxx forks.that would be pretty ideal to be honest Edited June 10, 2009 by Ash-Kennard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walker Posted June 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 (edited) 1050, 72, 380, +20 nice clean lines, with the downtube bottom flat, then into a rounded point near the top (_) stylee, a bolt hole to go through the frame into the seat post to keep it in place, vee mounts under the seatstays AND on top, so you can choose. built in booster, no disc mounts, nice, simple colour scheme, such as matt black with white stickers, or brown frame and black stickers (STICKERS, NOT ETCHED ONZA! SO WE CAN TAKE YOUR SHITTY GRAPHICS OFF),vertical dropouts. wide enough for a 2.4" tyre110 headtube1.8kg300 quid maxEDIT: made using a std size fork, not koxx forks.that would be pretty ideal to be honestI think you've hit it bang on apart from those bits ^^If you dont want a disk mount, then just grind it off. 1050 might suit some, so a longer version of say 1065 would be good for taller riders. Surely you can be more imaginatve with colours! A nice gloss bright colour perhaps. An why bother having mounts under the stays? Oh, and theres nothing wrong with a std seat collar.Also 1.8kg is definitely too light for a street frame. 2kg is a bare minimumOther than that though, i like your thinking Edited June 10, 2009 by walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash-Kennard Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 (edited) the 06 controls weigh bout 1.8, they seem to be fairly sturdy...i forgot to say, same alu as the 06 controls fe bout the disc mounts, but i will never run rear disc, and everyone who does seems to kill their frame, giving it a bad rep, then they dont sell how about a chrome colour frame, with free stickers of your colour choice and a can paint and laquor?i hate saddle collars, they never work very well and look pretty shit. but ive had second thoughts about the bolt thing too.and the length of it. maybe one in 1040, and a long in 1065? Edited June 10, 2009 by Ash-Kennard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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