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Is Anybody On Here A Hardcore Christian?

Davetrials

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casualjoe Trials Master

casualjoe

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Posted

As a species we can fly in loads of different ways, see and talk to people on the other side of the world, accuratly predict the outcome of millions of experiments. In the future we may be able to teleport, materialise objects out of thin air with the growing knowledge of nanotechnology and grow new hearts for people with dodgy tickers. Our brains have changed with the type of thoughts and information held somehow within them so make way for newskool evolution baby cause its taking over. :lol:

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Shaun H Too Much Spare Time

Shaun H

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The reason that things dont add up is because its made up. Christianity adds up and doesnt have holes in it.

Scientists dont actualy re-evaluate things, they see a problem and make up some cock and bull story to fill it.

Saying that humans evolved from Monkeys and that changed to suit our enviroment is dumb, if its true why cant I grow furr all over my body in the winter? or grow realy tall so I can change a light bulb?

If humans and animals evolve, why dont seals grow realy thick skins and become super huge so they dont get clubbed all the time?

Humans have not evolved, they have simply learnt things. The Germans had plans for Rail Guns during WWII but never got a chance to make them, if we do evolve, why did not the next generation of Gremans have the knowledge to build them, why has it taken 60 years to only build a gun that can shoot around corners with out exposing youreslf?

And, why do I not have the same knowledge as Albert Einstien? he was brainy shouldnt I have evolved to know what he did?

And why dont humans evolve to have complete knowledge when they are first born?

Its all just the order in which we learn stuff.

No, Im saying that there is no way that an animal can think that they should be less hairy, and then millions of years down the line it happens.

If I want my great great great great great grandchildren to have 13 fingers, will it happen?

I know about the theory of evolution, it is just as silly to me as what my post seem to you.

Its impossible to change your physical make up to change your surroundings, if you could people would have cottoned on to that durring battle camoflauge is extremely important and they would have changed there apperance to become camoflauged.

And battle has been hapening since for thousands of years, so they could of been evolving over that time.

But has it happended? No people just were camoflauged clothing.

I'm sorry to bring this up again but Bol you need to completely forget everything you appear to have learnt about evolution.

I'm guessing your church scholars have used all this completely revised (and wrong) theory of evolution to show you why creationism is the only viable truth. No wonder you believe so strongly that evolution is false, the theory you have talked about is quite rightly complete bullcrap! You are being taught evolution by people who are either guessing the facts or who want to blinker you from the truth! Now there is an environment of people who I would not want to be around, people who are so worried you will question your faith in their church that they will lie to you in order that you do not doubt! Clearly they doubt the strength of your faith... (or are just plain lieing about something they don't understand, you pick, either way it's a disgusting way for a supposed Christian to act)

Now clearing your mind of all preconceptions and misconceptions (come on now I know it's hard for someone so set in their beliefs!) try to understand the following.

1. We will take a given species, giraffes will be a nice and simple example to follow.

2. Now imagine all these giraffes are just zebras. Don't argue the toss about this, it's not strictly accurate but it will do as a base to try and explain the evolution process.

3. These giraffes being the same size as zebras feed off the ground, there is vegetation in the trees however it is too high for them to reach!

4. During the conception of a baby giraffe there is a gene mutation which causes the offspring to be taller (be it longer legs or longer neck).

5. This baby giraffe goes on to live more succesfully since it can reach the vegetation in some of the lower trees!

6. It mates and passes this mutation on as do it's offspring and their offspring etc etc and over hundreds to thousands of generations this mutation, since it results in better survival, spreads through the species until the entire lot have this gene.

7. Similar mutations (and not so similar, take for example the giraffe's long and tough tongue) continue to occur so that eventually over millions of years and generations (not instantly like you have been told!) you have a giraffe which is completely different from the zebra that still only feeds off the ground whereas the giraffe is so specialist it feeds almost exclusively from trees!

Important points:

There is no thought process in the animals that cause evolution to occur. It is simply a mutation, an event that has a proven statistical chance of occuring in each conception, that results in a beneficial change in the animal.

Mutations are almost always not beneficial and the animal does not survive as well and that particular new gene will dissapear. However as illustrated with the giraffe's changes above, those few that give the animal better survival are passed on and spread through the species.

This process of random mutations resulting in a beneficial change for the species has been observed in bacteria. They were placed in an environment where they do not survive as well yet a gene mutation occured that allowed the bacterium to survive better in the given conditions. This stronger gene became dominant as it survived the conditions better than the weaker original.

Oh and for the record, we have just as many hair folicles as a chimp. :turned:

EDIT: Not forgetting: Your point about Nazis and rail guns. Erm what the f**k? Technology and evolution are far removed. Technology is a process that moves infinitely faster than evolution, which takes millions of years to accomplish significant changes.

Evolution in humans is no longer occuring. We now look after even the sickest and most redudant members of our population. Just think, back when our species was living in caves and hunting mammoths, an asthma sufferer would quickly die! Let alone wheelchair bound window lickers, how the hell would they survive! The truth is if the human race wanted to advance any further PHYSICALLY (not technologically!) then we have to start unplugging all the vegetables and anyone else with a "defect".

I hope this gives you a better understanding! I look forward to any questions you may have.

Edited by Shaun H
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Spider Lad Trials Dude

Spider Lad

Posted
Posted
The reason that things dont add up is because its made up. Christianity doesn't add up and has plenty of holes in it.

Blind faith believers dont actualy re-evaluate things, they see a problem and make up some cock and bull story to fill it.

Saying that humans evolved from Monkeys and that changed to suit our enviroment is dumb, if its true why cant I grow furr all over my body in the winter? or grow realy tall so I can change a light bulb?

If humans and animals evolve, why dont seals grow realy thick skins and become super huge so they dont get clubbed all the time?

Humans have not evolved, they have simply learnt things. The Germans had plans for Rail Guns during WWII but never got a chance to make them, if we do evolve, why did not the next generation of Gremans have the knowledge to build them, why has it taken 60 years to only build a gun that can shoot around corners with out exposing youreslf?

And, why do I not have the same knowledge as Albert Einstien? he was brainy shouldnt I have evolved to know what he did?

And why dont humans evolve to have complete knowledge when they are first born?

Its all just the order in which we learn stuff.

You are a complete moron. You clearly know nothing about what evolution or natural selection actually is.

Your arguments are so childish and short sighted it's difficult to begin to correct you without explaining the whole thing in great detail.

Wiki on natural selection

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mintsauce Trials Dude

mintsauce

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PM Matt Barlow

I wouldn't say "hardcore" but he's got the faith :)

Andy

I'm happy for you to PM me Davetrials regardless of the fact that I haven't read any of the 30 pages of this discussion.

-------------

I wondered what people thought of this:

Roger Pensrose (check out his awards and honours!) co-authored 'The Nature of Space and Time' with Stephen Hawking. Penrose and Hawking , whilst working on 'A Brief History of Time' together, attempted to calculate the probability factor of this structured ordered universe we live in coming about by chance.

According to Penrose, the odds against such an occurrence were on the order of 10 raised to the power of 10123 to 1 (which would be 1 followed by 10123 zeros).

Roger Penrose comments concerning this mind-boggling number “Even if we were to write a 0 on each separate proton and on each separate neutron in the entire universe- and we could throw in all the other particles for good measure- we should fall far short of writing down the figure needed.”

Peace

Barlow

Edited by mintsauce
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F-Stop Junkie Trials Elite

F-Stop Junkie

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Posted
You are being taught brainwashed about evolution by people who are either guessing the facts or who want to blinker you from the truth! Now there is an environment of people who I would not want to be around, people who are so worried you will question your faith in their church that they will lie to you in order that you do not doubt! Clearly they doubt the strength of your faith... (or are just plain lieing about something they don't understand, you pick, either way it's a disgusting way for a supposed Christian to act)

Matt Barlow Hardcore... There's three words I never thought I'd hear in the same sentence... ;)

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Al_Fel Too Much Spare Time

Al_Fel

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Posted

I don't understand how people can use God as an excuse for our existence and have no explanation of where God came from. If we are here because God made us then surely God must be here because someone made him. Is it so hard to look at evolution and consider it a sensible solution to things we can see right in front of us and touch with our own hands rather than take the word of outdated books?

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ilikeriding Trials Elite

ilikeriding

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Posted (edited)
Yes humans have learnt things, but it is not simple process. I think learning and evolution are linked in some way, most notably in human evolution. Nature is changing, whatever humans do is still natural as we coexist with other forms of life (a sort of newskool nature) so developing technology and scientific research is now part of nature.

yeah a better ability for learning gives greater knowledge of how to survive/reproduce successfully therefore a genetic ability for better learning will be passed onto siblings of that parent they then go on to reproduce more and so on.. people without this ability are less likely to survive so eventually the majority of people have this new mutation.

Makes me think... with all we know about evolution, surely people with disabling defects being cared for or people being treated for cancer etc and being given the ability to have kids is going against this, giving them an equal chance to reproduce as a healthy person meaning that in future alot more people will have those conditions. Perhaps that is a factor to do with why cancer is alot more common now than it was a hundred years ago.

Medical Science helps people less fortunate and so does Christianity so in that way they are the same but...

Is it more compassionate to help people in those situations now or leave them in order to prevent a greater number of people in the future suffering?

Edited by ilikeriding
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middleageman Trials Dude

middleageman

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Posted (edited)
I'm glad to tell you all that a certain gentleman moderator just pointed me to our new bible.

The Devil demanded suicide porn... I give you Suicide Girls: "The most beautiful nude images of the SuicideGirls from the past 8 years."

:giggle:

Holy f**k! I already knew of this site! I only posted on here to gain some enlightenment and banish my demons. The wheel has turned full circle.

I now know my destiny. :closedeyes:

edit: oh yeah, and of course the creator of life/birth..........is a Woman!

Edited by middleageman
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Mat Tea Why Trials Dude

Mat Tea Why

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Posted (edited)

I am quite tempted to spend a whole day relpying to posts in here, however I am not sure I could keep my post under the maximum character limit :)

First of all I have to say I am appauled by the ignorance displayed by both Theists and Atheists in this topic. People are entitled to believe what they want: we cannot prove or disprove the existence of a God or the Big Bang. You really need to research someone's beliefs before you critise them and you might not have a way of researching someone's beliefs without asking them, especially if they are an Atheist.

The thing is, Because you are not a Christian, you havnt attended anything that is Christian and havnt seen any thing happen trough the power of God.

Saying that your dog is a God is stupid becase your do hasnt actualy done anything amazing like God has. There is actaly a lot of proof of the existance of God through out the world, you just arnt willing to accept it. Where as there is no proof of your dog healing the blind, or saving anyone from Satan.

Tell me, do you believe in ghosts or spirits? if you do, then you cannot not believe in God, because He and the Angels are spirits.

What is the evidence? Blind people unexplainably being able to see again? Maybe there is a scientific explanation for that. Even if there isn't an explanation it doesn't mean it was the will of a God.

Lets look at it like this: something cannot be explained so it is the will of a God. Well then surely you are saying that the lack of an explanation for something is infact proof of a god. Its like saying "I can't explain something therefore I can explain it." Furthermore it will be difficult for other people to explain an event like this because 1. They were not there and 2. They only know the anecdote you describe, so they miss the parts you delete/edit out of the story (even if you do not intend to.)

That existence has always been makes the most sense to me.

You make some very intriguing points. Personally my thoughts on time end up only contradicting each other (much like my thoughts on many of the subjects in this topic.) However ultimatley I think the universe may have just blipped into existance. Now this may be hard to understand as inevitably the question 'What was there before that?' will be brewing in the minds of almost every human reading that statement. However just because a human mind (which I think although it is the most dominant on this planet, it is certainly primitive when it comes to understanding the complex mechanics of our universe) cannot comprehend something, does not mean that it is plausible.

The time has always existed analogy satisfies our methods of comprehending such a topic, but I think this way of thinking could certainly be flawed because of something a retired teacher once told me (I'd be damned if any of my teachers had told me something half as useful). You seem to be a very intelligent and educated man, so I am assuming you have heard the 'Turtles All the Way Down' story: in which a famous scientist (ironically nobody is sure of who it was anymore) was giving a lecture on the basics of our current astronomical theories (the Earth revolving around the sun etc) when at the end of his lecture an old woman approached him and said that "What you have just told us is false: the Earth is not suspended in space, it sits on the back of a giant turtle." To which the scientist asked "What does the Turtle stand on?" and she replied "You can't fool me, its turtles all the way down!".

Now the idea of an infinite number of turtles stacked on each other just to explain the position the Earth is in is a humerous idea to me. So what would happen if we replaced the word 'Turtles' with 'Time?' Then we have "Its time all the way down!" Which now seems just as preposterous as the Turtles idea. So we begin to see the possible flaw in this way of thinking. You can replace the world turtle for a lot of other words aswell, however that would only stray from the original subject more :P

Apologies for any bad grammar/spelling in this post. I'm tired and I have a problem with of my eyes so my vision is quite blurry atm.

Edited by Mat Tea Why
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1a2bcio8 Too Much Spare Time

1a2bcio8

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You make some very intriguing points. Personally my thoughts on time end up only contradicting each other (much like my thoughts on many of the subjects in this topic.) However ultimatley I think the universe may have just blipped into existance. Now this may be hard to understand as inevitably the question 'What was there before that?' will be brewing in the minds of almost every human reading that statement. However just because a human mind (which I think although it is the most dominant on this planet, it is certainly primitive when it comes to understanding the complex mechanics of our universe) cannot comprehend something, does not mean that it is plausible.

The time has always existed analogy satisfies our methods of comprehending such a topic, but I think this way of thinking could certainly be flawed because of something a retired teacher once told me (I'd be damned if any of my teachers had told me something half as useful). You seem to be a very intelligent and educated man, so I am assuming you have heard the 'Turtles All the Way Down' story: in which a famous scientist (ironically nobody is sure of who it was anymore) was giving a lecture on the basics of our current astronomical theories (the Earth revolving around the sun etc) when at the end of his lecture an old woman approached him and said that "What you have just told us is false: the Earth is not suspended in space, it sits on the back of a giant turtle." To which the scientist asked "What does the Turtle stand on?" and she replied "You can't fool me, its turtles all the way down!".

Now the idea of an infinite number of turtles stacked on each other just to explain the position the Earth is in is a humerous idea to me. So what would happen if we replaced the word 'Turtles' with 'Time?' Then we have "Its time all the way down!" Which now seems just as preposterous as the Turtles idea. So we begin to see the possible flaw in this way of thinking. You can replace the world turtle for a lot of other words aswell, however that would only stray from the original subject more :P

Apologies for any bad grammar/spelling in this post. I'm tired and I have conjunctivitus in one of my eyes so my vision is quite blurry.

I shall respond at a point that is not bedtime but I will say that the scientist (philosopher/psychologist) I think you are refering to is William James. He wrote, amongest many others, an interesting book on, "the varieties of religious experience". He was a pragmatist, holding the conviction that if somebodies belief made them happy and caused no harm to anybody else, then it was quite irrelavent if it missed the reality mark. I somewhat subscribe to this idea in a relative sense but I think ultimately that knowing the proper truths about existence will lead to the prefered states of being.

Anyway, enough of the babble before bed as I want to actually sleep and not hear in my head conversations about God and universe >_<

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Al_Fel Too Much Spare Time

Al_Fel

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Posted (edited)

My thoughts on time is that it is just a measurement. An inch doesn't exist but we still use it to measure things.

Why do people think there is a meaning to life? Surely anyone that thinks rationally knows that it just happened for no particular reason.

Edited by Al_Fel
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