Pashley26 Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 cambelt and rockers? lads lets work this one out!anyone got a diagram of the engine?To be honest I can't see the point. Pushrods work on cams in the block....Cambelts work with cams in the head.It's impossible. Unless it's a DOHC with pushrods and over head cams hahahahaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Arnold Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 if i were you ads i'd ask to see the damaged parts and also question them about teeth which came off the cam pulley. if the belt snaps, then i doubt the pulley would be damaged as its relieved of any strain! unless the pulley was loose and snagged at an angle - causing the whole scenario!?WillTo be honest I can't see the point. Pushrods work on cams in the block....Cambelts work with cams in the head.It's impossible. Unless it's a DOHC with pushrods and over head cams hahahahahajust thinkin', maybe the rockers run directly off the cam shaft, so that the cam can sit lower in the engine, thus making the engine shorter?only thing i can think of! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forteh Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 To be honest I can't see the point. Pushrods work on cams in the block....Cambelts work with cams in the head.It's impossible. Unless it's a DOHC with pushrods and over head cams hahahahahaMy ohc motorbike engine has rockers and a cambelt, funny that - Why cant an ohc engine have rockers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 just thinkin', maybe the rockers run directly off the cam shaft, so that the cam can sit lower in the engine, thus making the engine shorter?only thing i can think of!So then it's got to have manual tappets, on a modern diesel car.I don't think so ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Arnold Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 could still have hydraulic lifters surely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 My ohc motorbike engine has rockers and a cambelt, funny that - Why cant an ohc engine have rockers? Well, rockers work on a rocking pedestal. As something pushes up on one side it pushes down on the other. So unless the cams sit under the rocker pedestal and push the rockers up onto the valves I can't see how it would work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Arnold Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Well, rockers work on a rocking pedestal. As something pushes up on one side it pushes down on the other. So unless the cams sit under the rocker pedestal and push the rockers up onto the valves I can't see how it would work.yeah thats what i was originally thinking will and jarr save the day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish-Finger-er Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 (edited) I have diagrams of the engine up on my pc in front of me, although not going to post them up here, as suposedly i need written permission off ford to copy them, and not sure quite how sh*t hot they are on it.But basically, on the 1400 tdci engine you have a set up like this. And jardo, thats pretty much exactly how the 2.4 transit engines work.The cams sit along side the valves on the outside of them. the rocker shafts sit above them.sort of like so..obviously one sides exhaust one sides inlet, there not to scale, and the valve timing isnt correct. Edited January 22, 2009 by Fish-Finger-er Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forteh Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 (edited) Well, rockers work on a rocking pedestal. As something pushes up on one side it pushes down on the other. So unless the cams sit under the rocker pedestal and push the rockers up onto the valves I can't see how it would work.The cam sits under the rocker (which has a needle roller cam follower) which in turn actuates the valve. Have uploaded a page from the engine manual which helps explain.The older oilcooled and early watercooled gsxr valvetrain was also done this was, not sure about modern bikes though.As will said there is no reason why there shouldnt be a hydraulic tappet aswell as rockers, on bikes theyre either shim buckets or screw adjusters, its much shorter service intervals though and easier to check edit: sort of beaten to it, exactly the same principle though edit: I bought the manual off ebay in pdf format so I dont really think there are going to be repurcusions from me posting a jpeg of a photocopied service manual for what is technically and obsolete engine :D Edited January 22, 2009 by forteh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Willis Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Doubt its the cam belt adam, think the rac mans right, would make sence that the engine has been starved of fuel and just cut out immeditly espically if its the high pressure one, take it to differnt gages and get differnt opions, Hope this helps mateyAndy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forteh Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 (edited) Doubt its the cam belt adam, think the rac mans right, would make sence that the engine has been starved of fuel and just cut out immeditly espically if its the high pressure one, take it to differnt gages and get differnt opions,Not read all the thread then? One of the cam pulley bearing shit itself, shed the belt and lunched the valvetrain Edited January 22, 2009 by forteh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Ahhh, cheers Kev and Forteh.I've never "seen" a valve set up like that, where the cams work under the rocker pedestal but it's a logical solution although there are more parts to wear. Some of the quad cam quattro valve set ups on things like lambo's and alfas are truly mind boggling ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forteh Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Ahhh, cheers Kev and Forteh.I've never "seen" a valve set up like that, where the cams work under the rocker pedestal but it's a logical solution although there are more parts to wear. Some of the quad cam quattro valve set ups on things like lambo's and alfas are truly mind boggling !You never looked at ducatis desmodromic valvetrain? Work that f**ker out The wear on a bike isnt a major issue as the mileage and service intervals are generally very low compared to a car, for example my 2001 supermoto has done about 7500 miles and had best part of 10 full services Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Arnold Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 yeh , thats the kinda thing i was thinking of! so next thing we need are some photo's of the damage ads!! would be good to see what damage has been caused exactly. and i wonder if ford will cover the cost?ducati are awesome! no more valve springs to ping around! no wonder they can rev so freely without problems! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Arnold Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 any developments ad? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
531joshua Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 I wouldn't have been letting the garage just rush into it all like that... also, a lot of pistons have a sort of cut-out in the top which means when cam belts snap, the pistons don't hit the valves (and bend them), as even if the valve is open, it just sits in the small cut-out in the top of the piston. Don't know about your car though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR28 Posted February 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Further news... it's a big job lolIt's been a pig to get the spares as the belt wasn't due til 150k so that's delayed things a lot...Was meant to be ready end of last week but they couldn't get the timing pins in as what they had in front of them wasn't the same as what was in the instructions! Turns out the cams on the camshaft have rotated (it's a 'new type' where the cams are pressed onto the shaft, not a one-piece cast one) so it needs a new camshaft @ £250. Add that to the other parts and that comes to £650... plus labour... which the garage say they will do a little cheaper as my car has been a bit of a guinea pig. So we'll see how we get on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forteh Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 (edited) Cheaper to buy a replacement head/engine surely edit: second hand of course Edited February 2, 2009 by forteh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR28 Posted February 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Probably... but the work is 90% completed now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Does this place have any height restrictions ? Family discounts ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forteh Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Does this place have any height restrictions ? Family discounts ?Overpriced refreshments and overly long qeues? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pashley26 Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Overpriced refreshments and overly long qeues?Sounds like Thorpe Park ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR28 Posted February 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Does this place have any height restrictions ? Family discounts ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al_Fel Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) ??You're being taken for a ride. Wake up Mr Tart lol. Edited February 4, 2009 by Al_Fel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
531joshua Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 That's what it sounds like to me. If i was you i'd have (as has been said before), got it checked out by more than one garage to get different opinions, just to make sure it was actually the cam belt. And by the sounds of it, it wasn't the cam belt, and by the sounds of things (as most garages do), they're trying to get as much money off you as is possible.Anyway, good luck with getting it all sorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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