Continental Race King As A Front Tyre?

[Jimmy_k]

Has anyone tried one of these for a front tyre?

Only 460g. Could pinch flats be a problem? Even though it says otherwise. It just seems ridiculously light considering the tryall slick is heavier.

The continental rubber queen also looks a good choice as a rear tyre, 872g, supposedly good pinch protection and a tacky compound. I've ordered one of these but I'm a bit unsure about the front.

opinions...?

[JonMack]

Stan is running a rubber queen on the rear too, so that should give you a bit of confidence in that decision.

Edited September 8, 2008 by Mark King

[Jimmy_k]

Aye, I saw him last week. Looks a good tyre. Seems to have a very tall profile.

Looks a chunky tyre, looks wider than it actually is. Well, to me it did.

Edited September 9, 2008 by jimbo160

[Muel]

I tried an old but unused IRC front tyre on my Kot yesterday that I found in the shed, it was pretty nasty, even when I ran it really soft I had almost no grip. It has really small knobbles which are spaced out quite a lot, and seems to be a relatively hard compound.

I think I'll end up getting one of those Rubber Queens one day, it would save nearly 400g over my minion.

EDIT: Looking at the tread pattern on the Race King, I don't think it would be all that good in mud, the knobbles are really small compared to a Try-All.

Edited September 9, 2008 by Muel

[Maximus]

Hi,

The continental race king, is a XC racing tire. There are lots of light racing tires on the market, some break into the Sub 400g. The tread is small with minimal height to reduce the rolling resistance. Personally I would use it as a front for street but not natural. Every one said that the new Try-All Slick would be poo based just on its looks, after some testing its has been found to be more grippy than the other tyres on the market in the dry, as it applies a larger surface area of rubber to the surface that its gripping. Its a myth to think that Big tread means big grip, it only applies muddy situations, Fact. And i still wonder why people use Massive DH Mud tread for Street its a bit silly, as less tyre surface is gripping ect, ect. A slick would be much better for street its a science fact.

It really depends what you’re using it for weather it be, Wet natural, Dry natural, Comp, or Street.

There are going to be tyres that perform better for each place/area.

My advise go get one and just try it, allot of tyre choice is personal, and some tyres are placebo.

Bike radar review of the Race king

Other very light racing tires to try.

Furious Fred

Schwalble Nobby nic

Schwalbe Racing Ralph

Maxxis Medusa

^^^Its a real mud tyre not for street at all.

I tried an old but unused IRC front tyre on my Kot yesterday that I found in the shed, it was pretty nasty, even when I ran it really soft I had almost no grip. It has really small knobbles which are spaced out quite a lot, and seems to be a relatively hard compound.

Yo they’ve changed the compound of most new tyres For 2008, what with black chilly compound, Also there are loads of Types of race king tyres, There’s 10 infact , its confusing i know but the Folding supersonic one is the one we are talking about.

Max

[Muel]

It was about 4 years old, so the rubber might have hardened over time? I know motorbike tyres do that, but they can take 15 years before you can tell the difference, on motorbike trials tyres anyway.

It had no grip at all, on our stone flagged path in the wet, it slid when I turned the bars if I rode along it, I then tried my Mod with the Try-All on the front, and the amount of grip I got from it was huge compared to the IRC.

I see what you mean about the slick tyre having more grip, but it is still good to have some knobbles on the rear if you ask me, so they can hook up on the edges of things where a slick wouldn't.

That Nobby Nic looks the best to me from the ones you posted, it's got some tread so it would be good in mud, but the knobbles aren't too tall, which would make the contact patch smaller. But at that price I think I'd rather have a Try-All, it's £7 extra for a tyre that's unproven on trials bikes, and from this website I found, it doesn't seem all that light, unless you could stand using the 1.8" version.

[manuel]

And i still wonder why people use Massive DH Mud tread for Street its a bit silly, as less tyre surface is gripping ect, ect. A slick would be much better for street its a science fact.

not entirely true ... without nobbles I would never have been able to ride across that wire. the nobbles do grip on to things edges corners etc... the only reason people use a slick front is because when do you ever hang your front tyre on the nobbles on the edge of a big drop ?

and also F= mN supposedly friction has diddly squat to do with surface area ....

(although i guess there is adhesion which does ...)

[ben_travis]

I like the look of that rear beast that stan is using. Shame its £30.

[Jimmy_k]

Ok thanks people. I'l get a race king ordered and report back when I've given it a try.

[psycholist]

and also F= mN supposedly friction has diddly squat to do with surface area ....

(although i guess there is adhesion which does ...)

What you're describing there is the Coulomb friction theory. This is a (Pretty good) approximation to what's really happening (Micro and nanoscale surface interactions). This is the easiest to teach in physics/engineering, but does not necessarily represent what happens in every system, especially with tyres (Where friction coefficients can be greater than 1). If Coulomb friction was correct then fitting wider tyres to a car or changing the tyre pressure (Lengthens/shortens the contact patch) would have no effect on its grip as the normal force and the friction coefficient would remain independent of the contact area.

Some more information here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friction and here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traction_(engineering)

To get back on topic, having used Continental tyres on my XC bikes and getting the crap scared out of me numerous times as a result of them sliding off anything damp, I wouldn't put Conti's on a trials bike unless I only rode in the dry.

[Maximus]

Yeah, mule they seam to charge over the moon for the Schwalbe tyres for some reason, just have a butchers on bike radar They have almost 500 good reviews of tyres. It would be cool if maybe the boys form tartybikes could test a few of them out for us riders, you never know these could be just as grippy, without the weight penalty of a conventional trials tyre. Im sure they could get some free samples from these big company’s, if the test proved successful they could be on a winner with weight weenies. Your connected mule, push it on them,,, lol

Bike radar tyre reviews

Other tyres to look at off the top of my head are, conti mountain kings, Maxxis High Roller (Folding 470g), And the Michelin XCR Dry²

and also F= mN supposedly friction has diddly squat to do with surface area ....

(although i guess there is adhesion which does ...)

I knew this would happen, lol. This is my take on it....

Dose 100% friction, mean 100% grip though? I did not use the word friction as although there is some, its always complicates things like this, as trials movement is light and very brief at best generating lower amount of friction compared with the Modules of calculations which take speed of force of the moving objects together, and as our tyres tend not to move when hopping it seems less influential in a way.

Adhesion is usually applied when talking about water bonding, but im sure the value of grip increases when surface area increases, that’s why F1 cars play about with tyre pressure so much, and that is to get the best set up with the heat produced, to make the tyre sit flat to get 100% Surface area in contact with the track. Enough of the geektales, Simple answer get people testing new tyres and to report back on how they perform on various objects, WE SO NEED A TYRE REVIEW STICKY THREAD...... Like on bike radar, or even a component sticky area with parts reviewed by, us the trials riders.

Max, any one get me?

[Ali C]

I tried a race king and a rubber queen.

First the race king.

Pros: Very light! tread will last a long time

Cons: Bad grip, sidewalls fold when going off camber, sidewalls rebound too fast (makes the front wheel harder to keep in one place, bad when riding small rocks), punctures easily.

As you might guess, I didnt think much of it, Maxxis tyres are better in every way except weight.

Rubber Queen:

Pros: Again, very light! bouncy for sidehops. tread should last better than maxxis

Cons: not as grippy as a maxxis, too tall for such thin sidewalls means it folds easily (I wouldn't dare gap to a slope with one). Not as puncture proof as a maxxis, not as predicable as a maxxis.

I was really interested in trying this tyre when I saw Thomas Oehler with one.

First impressions were how light it was! I had a quick prod of the knobs to see how soft they were, they were not as soft as a maxxis and the rebound was also faster.

I found that in use, the grip was ok, not as good as a maxxis, but I was on grippy rock. As soon as I went on anything off camber, the tyre would just fold! I had slightly more psi than normal, but it didnt seem to make any difference! I couldnt go on my back wheel on any off camber, thats one thing maxxis tyres are great for!

to sum it up, I still think maxxis are the best tyres out. Sure they are heavier, but that weight rewards you with stability and predictability on slopes and pointy objects. The Rubber queen was ok, but I think there's more important features to a tyre than weight. The Race King was just crap.

[Maximus]

Yo, Ali C, have you tried the maxxis High Roller 2.1 Foldable tyre as it is only 1.025 lbs. maby worth a try? Any Shwables some are quite light?

[grant_hundley]

why not get a maxxis UST... they are around 900 grams new, come in the popular minion and hi roller, give really good pinch protection...

they're about 27 quid off crc, so mid ranged sorta price

[Ali C]

Yo, Ali C, have you tried the maxxis High Roller 2.1 Foldable tyre as it is only 1.025 lbs. maby worth a try? Any Shwables some are quite light?

they don't come in the St compound, thats the key to maxxis grip, no other tyres come close.

Grant, they are only the 2.35 size arn't they? Plus like I said in my last post, lighter tyres fold more and are less predicable, that outweighs the advantage of being light in my eyes.

[grant_hundley]

Grant, they are only the 2.35 size arn't they? Plus like I said in my last post, lighter tyres fold more and are less predicable, that outweighs the advantage of being light in my eyes.

not sure on the size.. i've only ever had the 2.35 one and that was plenty wide enough..

yeah mine did fold a bit (i used to run about 15psi though) and i was using a echo 05 rim or a front echo rim with it, which are 40mm wide.

my friends recently put one on his try-all rim and uses 20psi at the most (hes a touch under 15 stone) and doesnt seem to have any problems with it

i've only used them on street so it might be a lot different on natural, but fatmike uses one on a dx32 and doesnt seem to have any problems

Edited September 9, 2008 by Grant-Hundley

[Ali C]

fatmike uses one on a dx32 and doesnt seem to have any problems

I wouldn't say Mikes bike is the most efficient at riding over rocks though

[manuel]

and also F= mN supposedly friction has diddly squat to do with surface area ....

(although i guess there is adhesion which does ...)

What you're describing there is the Coulomb friction theory. This is a (Pretty good) approximation to what's really happening (Micro and nanoscale surface interactions). This is the easiest to teach in physics/engineering, but does not necessarily represent what happens in every system, especially with tyres (Where friction coefficients can be greater than 1). If Coulomb friction was correct then fitting wider tyres to a car or changing the tyre pressure (Lengthens/shortens the contact patch) would have no effect on its grip as the normal force and the friction coefficient would remain independent of the contact area.

Some more information here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friction and here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traction_(engineering)

To get back on topic, having used Continental tyres on my XC bikes and getting the crap scared out of me numerous times as a result of them sliding off anything damp, I wouldn't put Conti's on a trials bike unless I only rode in the dry.

Don't worry I did do that part of the course ...

Dose 100% friction, mean 100% grip though?

Adhesion is usually applied when talking about water bonding, but im sure the value of grip increases when surface area increases, that’s why F1 cars play about with tyre pressure so much, and that is to get the best set up with the heat produced, to make the tyre sit flat to get 100% Surface area in contact with the track.

surely without friction there is zero grip so yes 100% friction = 100% grip ...

F1 tyres are all about actually sticking to the road... I even read somewhere that they offer max friction when they are actually slipping slightly - think slight wheelspin.

Anyways - in relation to bike tyres - like ali says there are alot of things that make up a good tyre - and one of them are some decent side nobbles at the rear.

Maxxis are pretty much the best right now - the compound is right - the volume is right - the nobbles are almost right ..... the weight is pretty good (especially if you get a single ply !!)

Edited September 9, 2008 by manuel

[Bigman]

Stan is running a rubber queen on the rear too, so that should give you a bit of confidence in that decision.

I am also trying a rubber queen on the rear at the moment, i have yet to ride any natural with it, just street but i realy like it, grip seems good, as ali said it is very bouncy which is nice for static moves, sidewalls are abit thin, but i am running it with a freeride tube and have no troubles, although i have only ridden it for 3 - 4 days, i will give a better oppinion once i have ridden it abit more.

Adam

[Maximus]

surely without friction there is zero grip so yes 100% friction = 100% grip ...

Anyways - in relation to bike tyres - like ali says there are alot of things that make up a good tyre - and one of them are some decent side nobbles at the rear.

Cool, no i ment it as a proportion, So if Friction levals were 100% and grip was only 70% there must me other factors envolved is all. That was all i was wandering dude.

Im still pushing for a "WE SO NEED A TYRE REVIEW STICKY THREAD"

And for tarty to try to blagg some of these Schwalbe Nobby nic's, Contientals, and Michelin tyres from the big names to test, as they are a big name online shop. Who knows maby get Schwable to make a new tyre for trials with the tartybikes team, And get some sort of deal going,,, Ideas??

max

Edited September 9, 2008 by Maximus

[Muel]

Well make it and then report it, then OBM or someone will hopefully sticky it.

I think it would be better as an FAQ topic though.

[ben_travis]

I am also trying a rubber queen on the rear at the moment, i have yet to ride any natural with it, just street but i realy like it, grip seems good, as ali said it is very bouncy which is nice for static moves, sidewalls are abit thin, but i am running it with a freeride tube and have no troubles, although i have only ridden it for 3 - 4 days, i will give a better oppinion once i have ridden it abit more.

Adam

surely you might as well be running a maxxis then? as the weight will be no different?

[Muel]

Having one of these tyres would save me 400g over my Minion, (2.50, Dual Ply, Front Tread).

Using a freeride tube instead of a normal one would only be 100-150g heavier I'd guess?

[grant_hundley]

bigman, have you tried it with a normal tube yet?

[JonMack]

I'm still laughing at Psycholist trying to call out Rowan There's a reason I ignore all his posts, but I shouldn't because some of them make me laugh so much!!