Aziraphael Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 (edited) Hey.I may be relatively new on here, but I'm not new to Trials riding.I've noticed whenever I mooch around these hallowed pages that there are an awful lot of riders espewing the view that "Mod is cheating"...I'm not here to start an argument, but I would like to know where this has come from and what other people think of the subject.Now, I'm fully prepared to be corrected on the following statement, but weren't the original Trials bikes all Mods?I'm fairly sure the name itself comes from the fact that they were originally modified from BMXs for motorcycle Trials riders to practice on and to keep fit between rounds/seasons.If this is true, then surely it follows that rather than 'cheating', using 'mods' is more true-to-form than the current crop of 'stock' bikes.I've ridden both, and yes some manouevres are naturally easier than others on a 'mod', but equally I find it much harder to do some moves on my 'mod' than I ever did on any of my 'stock' bikes.Would it not be a little more accurate to describe 'stock' Trials as more challenging option, something to aim for perhaps, than to refer to 'mod' riding as 'cheating'? I don't particularly like the idea that people out riding might be looking down on me for my choice of wheelsize, and I can't imagine any new riders feeling any different. A lot of newer riders really take on board what more experienced riders have to say about the sport, the equipment used and also the size/shape/style of bikes used...Putting forward an idea that people who ride 'mod' are doing so because its easier and therefore cheating seems to go against the grain of everything we say as trials riders, in that we pride ourselves on not being elitist tossers, don't you think? We always claim we'll ride with anyone, are happy to help each other progress and other things along those lines.Do these 'stock' riders somehow feel that their Trials achievements are being undermined by someone doing a similar thing but on a smaller set of wheels? Honestly?I ride 'mod' now for a couple of reasons; I'm a clumsy rider and was fed up with breaking mechs and tensioners on my 'stock', I really like the look of the 'mods', I find that I have more confidence when learning new things on a 'mod', and finally for some reason I see videos of 'mod' riders and seem to be inspired more by them than a lot of the 'stock' riders...Obviously a lot of this is personal preference , I'm not here for a "which is better?" debate, just interested in what people think- Adi - Edited March 12, 2008 by Aziraphael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash-Kennard Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 the mod is cheating comments are just jokes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil H Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Never ever heard anyone say mod is cheating. Some people believe it's further away from true mountain biking than stock but apart from that Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavyn. Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 yer it's just a laugh. you should be validated though. Can we still report someone for validation? gav Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simpson Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 I can't comment on anyone elses rides but....- On our rides if you cant take banter you might as well go home.... we will take the piss out of* Looks* Bikes* Ride Styles* BikesPretty much everything its just friendly and light hearted. Good constructed post though, welcome to members section Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Token Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Where there's choice your always going to get people taking sides (take a look at AMD vs Intel, Football Supporters or anything like that) There are a few Stock riders that say riding a Mod is cheating, an they could be considered as the 'elitist tossers' as you put it, but you get the Mod riders saying Stock is cheating, it's all tit for tat. 99.9% of the time it's people just having a joke around or abit of playful banter. But sometimes the odd person saying "Mods are shit, its not real trials" although we all know to ignore them because they're obviously talking out their narrowminded backside. The majority of the Trials community welcomes abit of variation an are happy to try new things an also respects other peoples choices for what they choose, again you are going to get the odd few saying to choose the part that they're using because they think its the best thing since sliced bread. I just think it's fine to offer out your opinion aslong as it isn't vicious or demeaning an in this situation everyone knows where to draw the line at slagging off other peoples choices.Oh an the first bikes to do Trials were actually XC frames, the mods only came about when Pierre Pi decided to modify a BMX for his son Ot Pi because he couldn't ride the large XC frames. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skoze Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 (edited) I can't comment on anyone elses rides but....- On our rides if you cant take banter you might as well go home.... we will take the piss out of* Looks* Bikes* Ride Styles* Bikes* Matt BirdPretty much everything its just friendly and light hearted.Fixed It's just a bit of banter, I had it in my sig for ages I like the way that stock riders take the piss out of mod riders and vice versa, but we all have respect for what each other does whem riding.Matt Edited March 12, 2008 by Skoze Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan_addison Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Its just like BMXers thinking that dirt jumpers wreck and dont repair, Frankly im quite sick wheelsize issues Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenLeacock™ Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Mod is gay, but not cheating IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar-rider Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 (edited) I possibly cant see how mod is cheating because it depends on how big or small you are and what bike size you feel confertable on, im pretty small and i ride a 20" but people that are big may want to ride a 26" or 24" so mod isn't really cheating and if it was cheating who would you be cheating against??? Plus if mod was cheating and every one thought that, then 20" bike manufactores wouldn't make mod bikes.lol..........jake Edited March 12, 2008 by Czar-rider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolver Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 cheating?is it buggeryboth bike types have advantages and disadvantages. It would only be cheating if both mod or stock rode in the same category in competitions, but then, they're too different for that to ever happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endohopper Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 An interesting take on a contentious debate , well explained aswell . Certainly in the fledgling days of our sport the distinction beteween Mod and Stock was useful and mods certainly had an advantage over what were at the time literally stock XC frames - tall , heavy and with wholly unsuitable geometry . A brief comparison of , say Koxx's current offerings of both types are radically different from back then in that contemporary designs are designed from the start with trials in mind . Now that weight , geometry and choice of materials has matured over several generations both types are largely identical with only small advantages being noticeable for certain manouvres . Because of this , ALL modern trials frames are optimised for intended usage so wheel size is pretty much personal prefference , and aside from small advantages , can be ridden at equal levels by an experienced pilot . As a result , any accusation of cheating is unfounded and can better be attributed to poor technique / timing / heavy finishing componentry . Y'know - like someone choosing to still run a saddle ... well that's my excuse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Rainbird Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 cheating?it is buggery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aziraphael Posted March 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 the mod is cheating comments are just jokes...Thanks for clearin that up I realise a fair few people are gonna be sayin this to me now... :$ Oh an the first bikes to do Trials were actually XC frames, the mods only came about when Pierre Pi decided to modify a BMX for his son Ot Pi because he couldn't ride the large XC frames.Thanks for clearing that up An interesting take on a contentious debate , well explained aswell . Certainly in the fledgling days of our sport the distinction beteween Mod and Stock was useful and mods certainly had an advantage over what were at the time literally stock XC frames - tall , heavy and with wholly unsuitable geometry . A brief comparison of , say Koxx's current offerings of both types are radically different from back then in that contemporary designs are designed from the start with trials in mind.Thank you very much, and that's a good point. Taken to a certain extention of this train of thought, (and bearing all the 'playful banter' in mind) aren't all you 'stock' boys trying to get closer to 'mod'? hehe!Interesting cross section of opinion...Next post?"Mod Is Gay"? Discuss...Just kidding...- Adi - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krisboats Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 I always make cracks about them as being kiddies bikes, but its generally just banter. Some people prefer them and some people don't, its their choice. If someones good on one then thats fair enough, i guess i do regard mod bikes as making things easier, especially for level gaps and stuff. You could sort of say i have more respect for someone who manages a massive gap on a stock bike, than someone who does the same gap on a mod bike. The levels of riding might be different and so the same gap might be just as challenging for each rider, but i guess previous connotations and bias from being a stock rider myself seem to mask that thought.Basically, mods are kiddies bikes, but i only mean that semi-seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cristoff Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 (edited) Yeah, Ash Kennard got me chased by pikeys wielding stick's because "my wheels where too small".Anywho, i don't think mod riders realize how hard stock actually is. I mean, I've rode mod for over a year, and stock for 5 days, and i can do like feck all on a stock. Its such a different riding style, but stock is agreeably alot more fun Edited March 13, 2008 by El Cristoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Rainbird Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 Yeah, Ash Kennard got me chased by pikeys wielding stick's because "my wheels where to small".Anywho, i don't think mod realize how hard stock actually is. I mean, I've rode mod for over a year, and stock for 5 days, and i can do like feck all on a stock. Its such a different riding style, but stock is agreeably alot more fun I've been on a mod a grand total of once, and it was actually a little bit fun if I'm totally honest (2 minutes of pure bunnywhop action!) so I reckon keeping things a bit varied is always going to be good, but stock (IMO) is far more suited to me. Yeah, riding the mod did seem to make things easier, but I wouldn't class it 'cheating' as such. Mods ride easier for some stuff, but there are other places that stock will have an advantage too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spode@thinkbikes Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 I wouldn't call it cheating, but I have to admit I've never thought particularly highly of Mods. Unless you're young or very small, I just think grown up bikes are the way forward For me, my roots are in mountain bikes, and I started riding mountain bike trials, not trials. Stock seems to open up a lot more doors in terms of technique and flow. Every Mod I jump on, I feel like I'm on a pogo stick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwbashaw Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 (edited) This is mostly a joke.People say it because some things are easier on Mods than stock bikes, but there are as many disadvantages to mods as benefits. A good example is in this video of a recent comp we had.http://tobe.observedtrials.net/Avaloncomp.wmvNotice that almost every stock bike made it up the quarters in the skate park and almost every mod had trouble. Other advantages of stock over mod is that stock bikes can span larger gaps, and roll over/up and down bigger stuff. Edited March 13, 2008 by cwbashaw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
python_man Posted March 14, 2008 Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 borrox to it all just ride, if a mod can do something and a stock can well whatever, and visa versajust ride for funi can only add that i prefer mods and they feel more flicky( just for me i might add) BUT i rode my mates A1 and craig schembri's (sp) KOT and they both felt pretty flickyits just personal preference and friendly rivalrymods can be better for some things and so can stock bikes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krisboats Posted March 14, 2008 Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 This is mostly a joke.People say it because some things are easier on Mods than stock bikes, but there are as many disadvantages to mods as benefits. A good example is in this video of a recent comp we had.http://tobe.observedtrials.net/Avaloncomp.wmvNotice that almost every stock bike made it up the quarters in the skate park and almost every mod had trouble. Other advantages of stock over mod is that stock bikes can span larger gaps, and roll over/up and down bigger stuff.To be honest though, and i don't mean this offensively to the riders, the stock riders the guy on the blue steed especially, looked far more competent than the mod riders in the skatepark environment. The mod riders couldn't judge how much speed they needed, didn't pump the ramps to gain that extra little bit of momentum and didn't try to get out of the quarter pipe in the normal way. The stock riders on the other hand flowed through, pumped into the ramps and generally looked like they new what they were doing.I enjoyed watching the vid though, looked like a fun competition with a good turnout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muel Posted March 14, 2008 Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 (edited) Thats because mods are shite for riding in skateparks. Mods are bestest.EDIT: Congrats on your seniorship! Edited March 14, 2008 by Muel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eskimo Posted March 14, 2008 Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 I find mods just require less effort to ride in general. But with a stock i have more confidence and also can go higher/ bigger or whatever. I do think long mods look ghey though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavyn. Posted March 15, 2008 Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 Anywho, i don't think mod riders realize how hard stock actually is. I mean, I've rode mod for over a year, and stock for 5 days, and i can do like feck all on a stock. Its such a different riding style, but stock is agreeably alot more fun stock is easy, I had one last summer and could ride it just aswell as my mod. aswell as picking up high 40's taps in a couple of days i don't find stock difficult (if anything i find it easier) I just love my mod because it's so flicky and fun. if i wanted to go big I'd get a stock.The bigger wheels are confidence inspiring on street, when you line up against a big up on a stock it's much less daunting than on a mod. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidehop Posted March 15, 2008 Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 Mod isnt cheating atall....How can you say its cheating, You cant. Mod's have there ups and downs. Stocks have there ups and downs. Its riders prefrance to which they prefer. And El Christof, If you started on stock you wouldnt be saying thats its hard now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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