Its Not Big, So It Must Be Clever?

[M-i-t-c-h]

Was at a demo at the weekend and a few of use got talking

a few things come up, one thing was how competitive group rides are no adays, how its always "who can tap that first" and also about what trials used to be like.

Going big was important but being creative with the riding seemed to be more so.

i think these two videos show the difference pretty well. After watching them, post honestly which was the more enjoyable style of riding to watch.

heres number 1.

and heres number 2.

does anyone else thing trials has lost its creativity?

[Muel]

I thought number two was more fun to watch, they both are amazing riders, number two was just more creative and technical.

Here is my favourtie video though:

[Krisboats]

No offence to mr watson, but number two is the better rider in my opinion. He can still go quite big, but at the same time is more interesting, imaginative and seems to be much more controlled. Plus that little wheelswap involving that wall and the post was fantastic, probably the highlight of the video for me.

I think its all very good to have big moves in a video... just balancing them with fun and interesting things makes the video 100x better.

[Broomer]

Agree with Krisboats. Dans vis is better.

[Davetrials]

yes it is competive, but its also helping you improve, i LOVE street rides when ive got loads of people pushing me and well basicly competing against me, the leeds ride is gonna be just that, people of all abilities pushing them selfs and one another, so i persoanlyl think its a good thing.

[Joe Papasnap Maher]

I dont wanna crash your thread, but on a similar note...

http://www.trials-forum.co.uk/forum/index....ny+damon+watson

[JT!]

It's really an open and shut case. You get this kind of thing in every sport, look at BMXing. You get people racing round tracks trying to beat people by tenths of seconds, and then you get people doing tricks up the side of a half pipe.

Just becuase poeple go big, dosn't mean there just out to be clever. That's a very ignorent view. It takes just as much skill and perfect technique to go big as it does to ride like in the second vid.

Riders who are going big are enjoying the sport just as much as everyone else. So why bitch about it? Why make threads finding out which is better to watch on a vid?

[Tomm]

It's not about which takes the most skill/practise though, is it? It's about what people enjoy. I totally agree with you - if people are enjoying what they are doing, then I say carry on. I wonder what people must think though - they see people on funny looking, really expensive bikes, with years of practise, just jumping up the highest wall they can find, and jumping off it again. I bet they must think it's completely pointless. And then I think that people might think of me like that...

[Christophe']

we are always dreaming up lines and linking moves in salisbury

has to be said, i think the poole/soton/pompey/plymouth riders have a lot more imagination when it comes to riding style

although i love the damon vid aswell

its all about the control/smooth not the big

Edited June 24, 2007 by Chris Abbey

[M-i-t-c-h]

Riders who are going big are enjoying the sport just as much as everyone else. So why bitch about it? Why make threads finding out which is better to watch on a vid?

good shout JT, it was more of a nostalgia thread, casting a mind back to the old skool, which personally i feel is a big part of trials, it is by no means a "bitch" thread, i have as much respect for the man who likes to go big as anyone else.

if one person has read this thread and they now looked at a wall or a gap in a different way then its done is job. i guess its real easy to follow trends and try and sidehop as high as humanly possibly, its just nice to see some "outside the box" riding i guess, which i feel trials is somewhat lacking at the moment.

p.s: this is no way a dig at Mr Watson or anyone else, what there doing for the sport to brilliant.

[JT!]

Sorry, i got the wrong impression of the thread now that i've read it properly. I thought it was one of those "I'm gonna bitch about riders going big" blah blah, but it isn't, my mistake.

I personally don't mind what kind of style i see in vids these days, i'm much more into how it's edited and filmed. You can get some guy doing a tap, a sidehop, a gap, a tap, a sidehop, a gap etc etc and it can be a very good video if everythings been thought out properly.

I personally want to see more vids with lines in these days, like, combining taps gaps and sidehops into one flowing line. Don't see much of that these days.

[Dan Jones]

I think its more about what inspired you to ride trials. When I started I watched riders like Ryan Leech and Jeff Lenosky who tend to do the more "creative" riding.

After seeing that I wanted to ride in a similar way.

[Tommy d]

It's easily video number 2 for me. Whatever you think of the size vs interesting moves debate, it hardly matters cos that video seems to have both!

It does seem like trials has lost the creativity for a lot of riders, more than anything else I am just amazed that people who are only about height and distance don't get bored with the lack of variety! But quite clearly they don't for the most part, so just let them get on with it I guess...

I like it when group rides have a competitive atmosphere, but not for the size of moves, but for when people give each other ideas and try to make longer lines, do different things on the same objects, be more smooth, stylish, etc, basically creativity! That just depends a lot on who you ride with though.

It doesn't happen very often but sometimes you see someone come up with a move that you've never seen done before, which takes skill and imagination. I think that's a far greater thrill than seeing someone gap even more amazingly far than last time.

[011001000110010101110010]

If you can spot and nail a line no one else can see thats a good rider. Provided the line actually takes skill.

Big moves are good, and give you a massive buzz. But for my the satifaction comes from doing lines other people can't get there "side hop, tap, gap" heads around.

I dont care how people ride, watching big moves for 3 mins plus is wicked, but lines are where its at.

[Ash-Kennard]

dan jones *** when hes back up and riding he will be monsterous once more.

i love both styles and try to do both creative and big lines, i get bored just doing one thing. but perfecting a single move can be very rewarding.

mitch was this convo with me, because i remember it but i can remember when or with who haha. and where were you today, your dad was at the demo but no mitch?

[Greetings]

Somebody close this thread before it turns in to a big row.

Obviously I prefer the 2nd video. It's just so much more interesting, you watch it and go "wow, i'd never think of doing a move like that!". Another thing i hate is when riders go big and look like they just did something big and brown in their pants. Effortless riding ***!

[squince]

I think its more about what inspired you to ride trials. When I started I watched riders like Ryan Leech and Jeff Lenosky who tend to do the more "creative" riding.

After seeing that I wanted to ride in a similar way.

I used to watch videos of chris walker when i started, i am totally different to him.

I thnik its more what floats your boat.

[Christophe']

i think we should all embrace the beauty of trials and the constant learning it gives us

i for one never want to stop learning trials

and just when u think its boring/plaid bang something new is learnt

even learning how to bail

i bloody love trials.

even with all the negativety that goes on on this site we have a bloody laugh in salisbury

7 years and all still riding

[Mat Smith!]

What i dont get is how does damon not have a style or any balance? i hear people saying it all the time .

Mat

[Muel]

The reason that I prefer number two is quite simple now I realise it.

While number one is clearly a much better rider than I will ever be, he is doing all these massive moves that look very similar to many other riders, all the top riders can hook a huge wall, it takes a lot of skill and a lot of practice, but once you have seen one guy do it, the effect sort of wears off.

Number two is much more creative, he is seeking out lines that I would never have seen, when I was out today I remembered this vid and some others and it made me want to look out for technical lines that I could do, when I usually just try to tap bigger and bigger things. Which isn't all that imaginitive.

Technical stuff is more fun in my opinion, but you can't beat the rush of making a big gap or drop, they are both different styles or riding and both have their own appeal.

Edited June 24, 2007 by KuelMuel

[monty boi]

I prefer number 2, but i prefer the more old skool style, sidehops to bash and pedal etc, like in the old ot pi videos, also i think it depends on what bike you go for, say if you ride a monty you will ride like you do in natural, as say if you ride a street bike you will be into all the massive taps/sidehops etc,

I also think it is who has inspired you to ride,

Adam.

[Mark W]

I don't know whether it's really just the rides I've happened to have been on, or whether I've got autism and can't read human emotions, but I'd say honestly that the attitudes of riders from my first ever group ride back in '01 were pretty much the same as the people in the last group ride I did a week or two ago? The first ride I went on was at Aberystwyth the day before a Nationals round at Corris, and so the trialsride.com guys were out as well as the welshriders.tk guys. We were all just riding around doing different stuff, but people would still call out lines and then everyone would have a go to see who could get it, or get it first. Plus there was still the push to try and go bigger, and the drive you got from riding with other people who were all trying to get better too. There werr the still "Streety" moves being done, but it was all still kinda spurred on by everyone pushing each other. Then when I went on my first proper group ride in Bristol, it was the same again. People trying to go bigger at the spot by that bombed out churchy place, streety shit at Lloyds and Mini-Lloyds, and then tech on the railway lines by the marina bit. The same sort of attitudes were there though, in a positive way. And again, with the last few London rides, it's been the same. I think the biggest factor that affects it though is going to be the spots you ride. If there's a mix of stuff then people will be more into doing creative stuff, but if people just do the usual "Let's go to that gradually getting bigger ledge, then that one, then that one" you're going to have a day of TGS shit on the go, but if people try looking for more diverse spots it's going to work out well.

Either way, the "fun" element people seem to only think existed "back in the day" is still definitely alive and well now, I think people are just looking back with rose-tinted glasses a bit too much...

[rocktrials]

Personally, i like watching street riding, but out of them, i thought the first was better, the 2nd, i didn't really find anything super special to watch, plus both of the music tracks sucked.

[nmt_oli]

I prefer the smooth creative stuff, may be because i can't go big (although im not that good at smooth either ) but maybe thats just how my mind works, im competetive but not stupidly so, but i am a perfectionist in a lot of things, so maybe its to do with that.

Anyway, i think my sig says it all.

[Joe Sheehan!]

Video 2.

I much prefer the stuff where a rider will use loads of obstacles in an area in one line, not just your usual sidehop up, hook, pedal roll, drop stuff. The rider in video 1 is better than im ever going to be, admitted, but i prefer to watch a video where the rider has clearly studied an area and looked for a proper pukka line, and added spins, endos, crankflips etc as he goes along.

So yeah, video 2 is my faviroute of the two.