monkeyseemonkeydo

Definitely, 100% was Martyn Ashton. It's in Chainspotting outside Rio's burgers. He says that then it breaks into the 'Satan, Satan, S-s-s-s-s-satan' tune and riding in Newbury. The Hawyse one your thinking of is when some nutjob walks past carrying a full on cross telling them 'He died for our sins, how will you spend eternity in damnation' (or something) and he replies with 'I'm not really that bothered'. You guys really need to watch the oldies a bit more!!

No, it wouldn't but I really hate the thought of some self righteous Christian trying to save me from my sinful ways on my behalf. The thought actually offends me in some way, much like preachers on the streets spouting bible quotes and telling you to take Jesus into your life and repent... Must be the devil in me I guess.

I really wish you wouldn't.

I think the thing we're getting at in this thread is the difference between faith- like belief in something being 'the first cause' or whatever else that incorporates and Christianity. Christianity, the bible, Jesus, Moses, God and everything that goes with it has nothing to do with the cause of the Big Bang, the nothingness before it or the nothingness (?) outside of our own Universe into which we are expanding.

I don't think it's insecurity at all. It's the disbelief that anyone can so blindly ignore factual evidence and proof. The fact that we can prove things like the Big Bang and evolution actually happened is the point here. Picking on Hannah (sorry), she was unaware of any evidence for the fact our Universe is expanding and started at a singularity of some sort. The realisation of things like that may just make her think a little about what the creation story and the bible itself is about. Religion makes her happy, fair enough. And our Kiwi friend is also clearly a true believer and so long as he's happy, whatever. I just feel sorry for people like him who find comfort in something which seems (to me) so far from reality, verging on delusional.

No, I wouldn't be the slightest bit offended because I can see that downhill is impressive and quite a cool thing to do and a downhiller, even if he thinks trials is a waste of time and stupid is allowed his opinion and I'm sure would also think that it's also quite clever, even if he won't admit it! You, however, when someone questions your faith, simply get really defensive and ask for the thread to be closed. As for the things you've witnessed or have heard stories of, I just think you really need to question these things more. Everything you've described in your posts simply don't make sense. You, personally, seem to have been witness to several real life miracles. Outside of sensationalist (usually American) chrisitian groups, the world tend to see none. Ever (except jesus occasionally appearing in jars of marmite). If your healing man has the power to instantly heal someone, what the hell is he doing at a christian camp? Surely 'god' would have a far better use for someone who sounds like he has the power jesus himself and may, in fact, be the new messiah. Or maybe he's just a normal guy who is good at making gullible kids believe what he wants them to believe in a setting in which everyone has already accepted his truth and is unquestioning to start with? Oh, and I'm sure he's making a pretty penny out of the gullible kids too . Edit for the non-believers: Hallelujah!

Should I be pleased or angry?

It quite clearly is a discussion, two sides putting their point across... What you're getting offended by, I imagine, is the fact that the majority of people replying aren't as blinkered as yourself to the (very good) possibility that religion is a big pile of human created rubbish. You have done nothing to make anyone see things your way because, from your posts, you're in waaaaay too deep and, in my opinion, have completely lost touch with reality and are totally lost in the sensationalism side of religious craziness. In my opinion not all christians are nuts, just misguided. You, however, I would describe as nuts! On the whole Santa vs. God thing... JT has it exactly right but misses out the vital, final point- 'By the time people turn 10 (or so), they come to realise that Santa is actually just a nice made up story to give parents something to threaten their kids with if they're bad and impart some control.' So what, exactly, goes wrong which stops a lot of people from refusing to believe in a just as crazy story about a man in the sky once they're 10? Is it that the threats are greater? Eternity in pain and suffering > not getting a train set? Christianity Religion: the greatest lie ever told. (And believed).

Completely wrong. Your profession is your job, that is, what you make a living at. What Joe's saying is that unlike people like Martyn Ashton (and hopefully now Danny Mac) to name two, Damon is not professional and never will be while he persists with the 'don't give a shit, trials riders are dicks anyway' attitude. No company in their right mind would offer to actually pay him to represent them while considering his attitude. As Joe said, not a dig, just the truth. And comparing professional trials with professional rugby or football is also stupid. There are thousands of professional rugby/football players in the world and their attitude doesn't really have as big an impact on the teams/companies which they represent (to be fair, if they act like twats they're probably more like their supporters than if they were well behaved...). Trials however has maybe 40 riders in the world who actually make a living doing what they're doing so they must be far more careful with how they put themselves across. Well in which case he really needs to sort out his online persona/attitude because at present it sucks!

Sorry, my bad.

Reverse psychology, eh?

But that immediately goes against what the bible says, and if you're questioning that then the rest of the book becomes donkey turd too surely?

It's got nothing to do with breaking something, it's about having a shit attitude and plastering the broken something over the internet, without making any effort to let people know it was a one off frame or anything like that. I also think a sponsor may have something to say if the rider sells a free prototype frame which he's been sent to test and provide feedback on. Or am I missing something?

lol.

Hostile takeover? I like it! I like the idea from Men In Black where we're just marbles in a far greater Universe that we can't even begin to comprehend...

Google 'Big Bang proof' and fill your boots. Basically due to 'red shift' we can PROVE that the universe is expanding. The age of the Universe has been measured and from this you can gather that over the past 16 billion years (or so) the Universe has expanded from a point source. Even the static you see on an untuned TV is evidence of the Big Bang. So then, what's the proof for your magic man creating the Earth in 7 days and magicing man (and the odd talking snake of course) into existence from thin air?

The creation story?! Well that certainly can't be proved because it's a complete fallacy! If you truly believe what is written in the first part of the bible (which should be enough to put any sensible off reading the rest of the book) then... I don't even know what to say. The Big Bang theory is not just a theory- the cause of the initial explosion is not yet understood but it is possible to measure the age of the Universe, the velocity and acceleration in which matter is expanding and is therefore undisputable. It's also proven to take a little longer than 7 days for the Earth to be 'created'. Likewise evolution, DNA profiling linking manatees with elephants, early homosapiens part way between ape and modern man. Again, these are facts. And precisely what 'evidence' are you talking about? Or are we back to 'the bible says it so it's true'? Though actually I think you'll find that the bible has been changed a great deal over the years.

I'm not quite sure if I'm following your argument, but it seems to be based on materialism being fact rather than a philosophy. Dark Matter, for example, has no concrete evidence for it (as yet), but it serves a purpose to explain how our Universe works and in doing so makes sense. We could've called Dark Matter god if we wanted because in itself it's a human creation to explain something we don't yet understand, but that would be foolish in itself. The existence of 'God', which is a purely human creation, serves no purpose except to try to comfort humans that there is something after death which is worth striving for during life. I don't understand how you can even start to question those things. Those are facts. The fact that the universe is expanding isn't exactly difficult to grasp- it started at a point and has since been accelerating outwards (into, I imagine, true nothingness) for about 14 billion years. You can see from skeletal remains how evolution has worked over millions of years...

But it's a self obsessed human idea that something (or someone) had to create the gasses and all that jazz. There are a whole host of theories about what might have caused the initial singularity which caused the Universe to start expanding, but the evidence that it happened is there. In my mind I see no reason why there can't be an infinite number of individual Universes outside our own (not talking parallel here, just co existing outside of our own), or that our own Universe hasn't been expanding and contracting into a 'Big Collapse' cyclicly forever and may continue to do so forever. Again, what you're getting at (I think) is not christianity. Christianity is the teachings of god through the bible which is just a fictional novel created as a form of control for the general populous. The 'first cause' of the big bang comes under something completely different. If you want to call that cause god, that's your call, but surely that can't be the same god who created the world in 7 days and sits on a cloud or whatever. Big Bang wiki.

I don't think he'd be too impressed to be fair...

(Click the pic... it's an oldy but it's a goodun) And to Hannah- yeah, chistianity's obviously not about healing powers, unless you're a narrow minded brainwashed American... It's far more about trying to control the flock and subduing the masses. Oh, and in times gone by trying to stop 'heretical disobedience' (otherwise known as scientific discovery and free thinking) by torturing and murdering people who opposed the church. Christianity really has a lot to answer for.

STFU.

Ah, right, in that case it was clearly a miracle and an act of god so hallelujah, praise the lord and all that jazz. Maybe the guy should start working as a doctor curing cancer rather than wasting his time at christian camps...

Sorry, Typed that then found Bol Maaaaaaing's previous post which I decided to reply to instead .